GW: The Hobbit Returns

bilbo-shocked

Games Workshop is recommitted to bringing The Hobbit back to the tabletop.

The Hobbit licenses has been slumbering quietly since the last movie came out back in 2014 but no more! In a move no one saw coming Games Workshop is invoking the power of the One Ring yet again to bring it back to the tabletop:

via Forgeworld

At the Forge World Open Day Eddie caught up with Adam Troke, the Middle-earth™ products manager, to talk about the future of The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey™ Strategy Battle Game.

Why are we talking about The Hobbit in the Forge World bulletin? There’s an exciting new adventure ahead, I’ll leave it to Adam to explain, and to give you a glimpse of the future…

The big news in the video is that a new book for the Hobbit is coming out tentatively titled, “The Hobbit Motion Picture Trilogy: There & Back Again” which promises to revisit a few things in the 2nd and 3rd movies in greater detail. Also new models and kits are coming out:

hill-dwarf-warriors dain-ironfoot lake-town-house

Not pictured but mentioned were the Gundabad Berserkers which were some of the Orcs in the Hobbit Trilogy. The Lake-town House is also going to be a multi-part plastic kit which is pretty cool. In the video Adam Troke said that these new kits are the first fruits of “Games Workshop’s recommitment to the whole Middle Earth offer.”

Well that is certainly some good news for Middle Earth & Hobbit Fans out there…you will be rewarded for your “diehard loyalty” to the game. I, however, certainly did not see that coming. I think Ol’ Bilbo Baggins sums it up pretty nicely:

hobbit-surprised

 

I thought they took the Hobbits to Isengard. Oh that was the previous go…

  • Xodis

    You’re taking on too much GW. AoS just got turned around in successfully bringing a lot of angry fans back in, 40K needs a desperate overhaul. Slow and steady GW, you already have an empire, try to mend the fences before expanding further.

    • Anti-Gravity

      You must be confused because they aren’t expanding since they’ve already had the LotR rights for ages, and this IS them mending their fences. You didn’t think that post through very well, did you? Games Workshop alarmist.

      • Xodis

        No, the fallacy here is you thinking having the rights equals doing something good with the franchise. LotR/Hobbit was “deader” than WHFB even before GW decided to kill it for good. GW is trying too much too fast, its a common business reaction when things are not increasing as they expected/want them to be.
        What we are seeing is GW “shotgunning” every idea they own in an effort to boost sales. Don’t get me wrong I’m excited about AoS (have been since its release), I’m also excited about a 40K edition that isn’t just a barrel of rules that just keep hanging on like the monkeys do. I’ve even picked up some specialist games that happen to work with both previously mentioned franchises.
        What they need to focus on is getting everything right and supported before tacking on yet another game system. Otherwise we will end up with another 40K8e that has to be “fixed” with 40K9e in less than 2 years, and a bunch of Specialist games that haven’t seen any new content for the better part of a decade. You dont have to be an alarmist to notice the trend, only a realist.

        • Matthew Pomeroy

          I dont think that is entirely right, if AoS was such a success they may not have felt compelled to bring back and shotgun products. As for Lotr/hobbit, it has a solid mechanic that does not need any real work, all they have to do is make minis.

          • Xodis

            “all they have to do is make minis” Oh is that all? lol

            AoS was always great, but I will concede that it wasn’t until the recent release of the Generals Handbook that its becoming a real success. The GH has brought in a lot of players who couldn’t handle AoS’s approach to balance. The tournament community is thriving because of it as well.

            I’m not saying LotR/Hobbit wasn’t a good game, I heard a lot of good about it, but its not what GW needs right now. What they need it to bring back their number 1 game to the front and center and make 8e the 40K edition that beats all editions. Its their number 1 source of income, and its a complete mess.
            Once thats set up well, then come in with LotR as the Phalanx/Brick of soldiers game that old WHFB gamers want and love. It makes sense in the LotR fluff, and works as a peace offering to those who like that style of fantasy battle.

          • Matthew Pomeroy

            Yeah as one of the very very few people in my area that actually plays AoS, it is not great, and the GH while I personally thought it was pretty good, actually ended up driving even more of our tiny group away, it brought none back. That is definately a regional thing. 40k is certainly their cash cow, but they need to not ignore the fantasy genre too much.

          • Xodis

            Thats the first time I’ve ever heard that story, but its a large world so Im sure it had to happen somewhere unfortunatly. Im basing my guesses off of the 3+ FB groups with well over 10K people though, not just my personal area.

          • Matthew Pomeroy

            its not a rare story at all. there are huge facebook groups for games that dont even exist anymore in print so thats pretty useless, I am a member of FB groups for AoS that are nowhere near where I a live.

          • Xodis

            I was talking specifically to your GH story.

            As to the FB group, thats over 10K in the (very rocky) year that AoS has been out. Its still a young investment and with about 20K liking the official FB page, its a good indication that the game is doing well, or at least good enough to invest more effort into.

          • Matthew Pomeroy

            the irritating thing about it is, the guys who were cool with the no points (WoK does it too) flipped out about points in the GH, and bailed. Its not like points are required, its just an “option”

          • Xodis

            Yeah I never understood that. Being mad at a game for options that are completely optional, is about is silly as it comes.

          • Matthew Pomeroy

            It does make it hard when you have that 1 guy who just wants to freak out in a group. since we generally dont play points anyway it was kind of “awkward”

          • Xodis

            I hate those guys lol. My groups are normally just close friends so thats a rarity for me. They usually dont get invited back either hehe.

          • Matthew Pomeroy

            I usually play with people I know, but I am not a fan of xwing or warmahordes, so its hard to get any other game in at the local, we ended up with more of a pickup group, the store declined to run the WWC, so we just did our own thing.

          • Austin Becht

            The Hobbit/LoTR community has been thriving ever since GW “killed” the game previously. Its absolutely MASSIVE over in Great Britain and Canada, and there’s been a significant surge in popularity in the DC area, enough that there were actually Hobbit tournaments held at the NOVA Open this and last year. The game is far from dead. The only reason the game seamed dead is the same reason why Warhammer died: a lack of support. GW have now begin to realize that stopping support for a product line does actually lead to declining sales…and given GW has the rights to pull things from the Appendices now, they’re in a prime position to milk the franchise for as long as it remains popular, or at least until their contract runs out in, what, seven years or so?

            Plus, what’s wrong about opening up another revenue source, especially when you know it will sell? LoTR/Hobbit is an extremely popular franchise. The name alone will sell the miniatures. It did before, and it will again. As said, the only reason it didn’t during the Hobbit trilogy was because they mismanaged the license…and they aren’t making that mistake again.

          • Davor Mackovic

            Where is LotR doing well in Canada? I was trying to get into LotR but it was dead where I live and then The Hobbit price increase/mini decrease I quit it because we didn’t know where it was going.

            If it’s doing well in Canada and I live close to it, I would love to get back into it.

          • Austin Becht

            Pretty sure its mostly in Ontario. But yeah, they have a league up there, the OSBGL.

          • Davor Mackovic

            Thanks, I will try and Google that and see what comes up for me.

          • Austin Becht

            Try Youtube, I know they have a channel under some name or another.

          • blackbloodshaman

            AoS is even deader than WHFB

          • Matthew Pomeroy

            In some places, sure, its dead as a doorknob, but in others I am sure it is flourishing, sadly I do not live in one of those places. It is not a good enough game for a 45 minute drive one way to play it.

          • Austin Becht

            AoS isn’t dead. A quick look at GW’s sales will show you its far more popular than you might imagine. It just didn’t catch on in certain areas. I mean, just because its not represented in your little pocket of reality doesn’t mean its not represented anywhere else. Hell, in my local GW, AoS has dwarfed 40k, with Hobbit coming in at a VERY close 3rd.

          • Gunsheeplol

            Says the Mantic shill. KoW is a dead game, meanwhile AoS is growing fast.

        • Simon

          By specialist games, I assume you mean the board games they’ve been shoveling out over the past couple years (Warhammer Quest: Silver Tower, Dread Fleet, Space Hulk, Deathwatch: Overkill, The Horus Heresy: Betrayal at Calth, Assassinorum: Execution Force, Lost Patrol)?

          I don’t think they’ve officially released anything under the moniker “specialist game” in quite a long time (even though they announced they’d be releasing some in the future).

        • Davor Mackovic

          Taking on another game system? I don’t get this. They had Lord of the Rings/The Hobbit for over 15 years. This is not a new system they are taking on.

          • Xodis

            As I said, owning a licence is not equal to doing something with the game. Even the most die hard of Hobbit/LotR fans admit that its not very well supported.

    • MightyOrang

      Well said.

    • ZeeLobby

      I agree with you here. They really are just doing a shotgun approach. Not sure about the AoS part, most fantasy players I know simply haven’t come back. That said they’re picking up some 40K players cause that ruleset is just awful right now. Would be nice to see them polish it sooner rather than later.

      • SophetDrahas

        If they’re doing a shotgun approach, why not take aim at WFB and Mordheim again now that they’ve decided to actually support their systems and fix what’s been wrong with them instead of just increasing the model count while increasing prices.

        • ZeeLobby

          Well WFB is gone. It’s just not coming back. AoS is here to stay. By shotgun approach I was talking about their board games and expansions. WHQ, Death from the Skies, Overkill, Assasinorum, gorechosen, etc. I mean WHQ supposedly sold well, soon expected them to follow up and expand. Instead they moved on to 3 other mini games. I’m sure mordheim will come back too, either AoSified or as part of their specialist games, after BB, Necromunda and The Hobbit.

          All this while their core systems and money maker, 40K, struggle to retain customers. You’d think they’d refocus now, but the tanker takes a while to turn I guess.

    • Ak318

      I would say you are incorrect in this regard as it no longer the main GW team dealing with this game anymore.

      You have Main GW design team: 40k & AoS
      Forge World: Horus Heresy, AoS, 40k
      Forge World Specilalist Games (a new specially set up team starting around last year): Board games, Blood Bowl, LotR and other reruns of the old specialist line up that will be returning soon.

      So I would say GW is not taking on too much cause the specialist game team will never touch AoS or 40k proper and the main Nottingham design team will never touch LotR now. Personally I say this is a great mive to support a strong fnbase in the GW community that has for a long while been shat on, much like the other specialist games.

      • Xodis

        They are though, as a whole, GW have numbers that have been flat at best and dropping at worst, adding a NEW division to work on games can’t be a good decision at this time. Business 101: stabilize your primary business before branching off into a further nighe within a niche, that’s within a further niche practically.

        • Ak318

          You say that from what I can tell the board games section of GW has become the big money maker as of late. Hence the loss of FFG and also why they are really pushing expanding the rules of the games to get you to buy more minis from the main lines.

          • Xodis

            Either that contributed to the break up with FFG, or possibly FFG have a Star Wars tabletop game…for GWs sake I hope its the first one.

            Yes, they are the current big hits, not because of the included game though (although I have high hopes for Gorechosen) but because of the amazing deals you get on the models. Its all about the price there.

    • NagaBaboon

      Trying to please their customer base is mending their fences, it’s fixing the damage that was done by the previous CEO. I don’t disagree that 40k needs a massive overhaul but they need to get everything else ticking over nicely before they approach a task that Herculian.

      • Xodis

        I agree with pleasing the customer base, I just feel that 40K, the actual money maker of GW, should be the prime focus not some game with a small handful (arguably less fans than AoS or the WHFB fans still holding on). Getting Hobbit/LotR or anything else small like that is trying to patch a dam with a bandaid, its best to focus on the real problem since the fixing real problem is what will keep them in business. (not that I believe that GW is going anywhere for at least a few decades more lol)

  • Ben Martin

    That house isn’t going anywhere near middle-earth. I know a town in the Realm Of Shyish that could use some actual houses…

    • Lewismauler

      Yeah it’ll be seen on many an AOS table I am sure

    • euansmith

      “The Lake-town House is also going to be a multi-part plastic kit which is pretty cool…”

      Plastic? My precious.

      • MPSwift

        It’s also modular so you can combine multiple kits/build each one in a unique way.

        • euansmith

          It is going to be 25mm I guess rather than heroic 28mm? Still, it looks like it can be a nice addition to the terrain selection. If only they would bring back some of the big WHFB kits, like Dreadstone Blight. I’m kicknig myself for not picking them up, as they would be great for Frostgrave.

          • Ross Allan

            Standard LotR size. They had quite a few on show at Warhammer Fest (not that the writer of this article seems to recall my dogged reporting on that….*sniff*). Reversible panels as well for added variety. Defo looking incredibly nice!

          • euansmith

            Super-duper! Was your Warhammer Fest coverage up on BoLS? I seem to have missed it.

  • Matthew Pomeroy

    I am glad they are bringing this back, its a great alternative to AoS.

  • Lewismauler

    That’s not an expansion of their empire, this already exists, this is them mending fences. It’s a line that they have had for years and has been left sidelined and almost went away completely. The release for the hobbit series was very underwhelming compared to the original lotr film line they released. And this isn’t new news. Adam Troke told us this would be happening months ago, he just had no images to be shown at the time and it’s just him and two other people on this hobbit team. 40k doesn’t need a huge overhaul its a great game, it takes some time and studying to learn it, but any great game requires that, it just needs the fat trimmed. Which all the credible rumour mongers have been saying they are already working on the next edition and that it will be more streamlined. They can’t just work on one aspect of their business at a time. They have to constantly make minor improvements across the board for every one. If they only focused on one at a time they would alienate huge groups of their customer and fanbase. Also if you paid attention to their direction of the last couple years it has changed drastically. Communicating with their customers and fans is leaps and bounds ahead of where it was. They are listening to their consumers wants and needs. They have reopened almost every avenue of social media for their brands. They are on the right track and Doug a damn good job of it.

    • LordRao

      Just out of curiosity: how many sculptors for LotR/Hobbit did they have previously? I know two doesn’t sound like much, but it’s about what Warlord Games have at their disposal for an entire slew of games.

      • Horus84cmd

        The LoTR trilogy had two sculptures – the Perry Twins – while the films were in production lockdown. When out a lockdown more projects went to a few other sculptures (don’t know how many). Similar story for the Hobby trilogy.

  • James243

    I’m not that interested in the hobbit, even though i hear its a good game. But i do find their commitment to the hobbit reassuring when it comes to investments in other marginal gw games – like their soon to be reborn specialist range (blood bowl, epic etc)

    • Ross Allan

      All under the same flag as well. Specialist Games are looking after LotR, with the Studio pretty much just doing AoS and 40k.

  • SophetDrahas

    With the death of WFB, I’d been considering getting into LOTR and The Hobbit as I’d heard it was a solid system. This may be some of the fuel to the fire that I needed. I definitely prefer this high fantasy style to the direction WFB and now AOS has been taking. More subtle with a historic flair.

    • Aezeal

      I’d say that historic flair makes it less high fantasy than AoS (You can argue easily hobbit/LoTR is high fantasy and AoS is over the top fantasy though :D)

  • Anti-Gravity

    Not a LotR/Hobbit player, but I’m glad they’re doing this because the line of models had some GORGEOUS alternatives for WHFB and even 40K. The Balrog was a wonderful Daemon Prince alternative, for example, and the War Mumak of Harad (the giant war elephant with platforms) was a GREAT model to add to my Beastmen army – with an Ungor bow and arrow crew riding it. I support this line just for the models because the Tolkien series has awesome classic high fantasy stuff that really provides where GW’s stylized stuff is too over-the-top quite a lot of the time.

  • Badtucker

    The fans are pleased…. if bols kept their eye on any legit rumours they would have seen that this overhaul was already announced months ago.

    • Horus84cmd

      Since GW have begun to properly embrace social media again and are make daily postings, BoLS has seen fit to repeat every one verbatim and report it as the second coming…because…reasons…

      Why they don’t just do a “This week on GW FB” piece once a week boggles the mind. For, one its must be so time consuming to do it this way – mind you copy+pasting is quick.

      Funny thing is that, by GW now really doing well with the social advertisement, not only are they beginning to keep up with the “leaked” fuzzy pic’s of new product with their own shinny well taken pics (and in some cases now, getting ahead of the curve). But, also with places, like BoLS, reporting every minor posting, GW are seeing talk and images of their product flood the sites and take front and centre focus, all the whilst seeing competitor product articles getting buried down various news feeds – reducing chances of those being seen or noticed.

      • Barty

        Hell they’ve even started running conventional adverts for some of there stuff. Like the Legends seres of hardback books has a tv ad in the UK.

        Not a great one, but hey.

      • jcdent

        It’s hard to put BREAKING NEWS on weekly reports

        • Horus84cmd

          Haha true

    • georgelabour

      This fan is please….If critics were as well versed in BOLS posting habits as they think they are then they’d have known they already did post pictures of some of these miniatures months ago.
      =^.^=

  • Shawn

    I had no idea there where any diehard Hobbit fans of GW’s game. Did I miss something?

    • Matthew Pomeroy

      yeah there is a pretty decent number of us. http://one-ring.co.uk/

      • Shawn

        Well, color me impressed Matthew. That kind of popularity for the Hobbit game I haven’t seen around these parts of the States. Well, that’s good then, if there is a fairly large community. Hopefully, this support will last awhile, yah?

        • Austin Becht

          Hobbit is actually flourishing in the states, at least around the DC area currently. There’seven a league, the DCHL. Hell, Hobbit was one of the largest games represented at the NOVA Open this year, with 58 players! And the game has been extremely popular in Great Britian and Canada since its inceptio
          .

          • Shawn

            I’m quite impressed. Here in my area no one ever played the Hobbit and the models just sat on the shelves of our local stores.

          • Austin Becht

            One of my friends once out it quite nicely

            “No one plays Hobbit because no one knows anyone plays Hobbit. All you have to do to get people playing, is to show them that there really are people playing.”

            He then succeeded in reviving the Hobbit community at my shop, and then made the DCHL…

          • Shawn

            That’s pretty cool. I’d thought about it at one point, but I was already heavily invested in 40k and warmachine. I also didn’t want to buy an army and not have anyone to play.

        • Matthew Pomeroy

          I am stateside and some of those guys are too. I admit my main reason for buying the minis is the same for most of my circle, for rpg uses in MERP and ONE RING.

      • Xodis

        Thats less than 10K people.

        • Matthew Pomeroy

          why is that a relevant number for a group?

          • Xodis

            Because in the big picture of things, thats a small number of players when considering the investment amount to bring the game back into the “mainstream”. Which means that GW will probably not make that much money especially when considering how much they COULD make by fixing 40K.

          • Matthew Pomeroy

            they aren’t an either or, forge world is handling hobbit lotr. Consider that’s 1 group. I never bothered looking for others. 40k is not a fantasy game so it will not scratch that itch for people, no reason to drop all those folks.

          • Xodis

            Their track record says otherwise. Without focus, any game they release could very well be another broken 40K6e that needs a whole new edition in less than 2 years.

          • Matthew Pomeroy

            they have plenty of manpower, otherwise just give up on AoS and focus solely on 40k? there is no reason to limit themselves.

          • Xodis

            Its a new game they just launched, that would be stupid. You dont quit halfway during an investment, unless it really was the flop some people want it to be.
            This isnt even a real investment, just a half cocked attempt.

          • Matthew Pomeroy

            the game is still in print and going, there really is not alot necessary. Its not like it is OOP or not being produced.

          • Xodis

            No its just in a state of WHFB pre end-times. Thats a sad state to be in. At least make an effort, or none at all. Again its a waste really.

          • Austin Becht

            Sad state? The game got added to the NOVA Open games lineup just last year, and is now one of the most popular games there. And there’s massive tournaments weekly in GB…

            FAR

            FROM

            DEAD

          • Xodis

            So is AoS, Imperial Assault, Armada, etc, etc…

            There are a lot of games already apart of it, and most have been out less time.

          • Austin Becht

            The first year, the NOVA staff was only expecting 16 players. We ended up with 30. This year, they expected 30, and got 58. If that’s not evidence that the game is more popular and worthy then you surmise, then what is?

            Not everything is 40k. Not everything is going to immediately produce you 50% of your yearly income. And, if you haven’t noticed, 40k sales have been declining somewhat…

          • Xodis

            Exactly why that should be their focus, when your main source of revenue is hurting, you fix that source of revenue.

            As for numbers, I dont know how many is really “a lot”. I just know that I dont participate in any tournaments, but I knew all those other games have a large tournament following, which for board games is something special, especially when I dont play any of them. (except IA and Xwing which I do play).

          • Austin Becht

            Except they are a large enough company that thy can do both? They’re already attempting to fix 40k with the new Black Crusade stuff, allleading into 8th. Why can’t they also work on Hobbit? GW is one of the largest, if not the largest, miniatures gaming company in the world. They can afford throwing 4 or so people at a project such as this…which, quite litteraly, is the amount of people they have working on this project. 2 rules designers, 2 sculptors, and maybe a few more? I’d imagine that’s an ant compared to the size of the 40k team.

            And one does wonder why you are so up in arms about this now when GW anounced its plans to reinstate the Hobbit line nearly a year ago, and anounced a more detailed plan of what that meant only some months ago. But then I guess you are just one of those people who comes on BoLS oly to whine and cry…

          • Xodis

            Because their track record show they can barely manage to take care of a single 40K moneymaking game, much less any of the others. Dont get me wrong, GW has made big strides recently compared to the last several years. Personally though it makes sense to go for a First Down with your primary source of income rather than a Hail Mary hoping something great comes from the Hobbit.

            Wow personal insults now? Didn’t know we crossed that line. No I dont whine and cry, just making conversation and tossing opinions. I know I talked bad about your game, but I didn’t know you would take it so seriously…should try and lighten up. Although usually people only get mad when they know someone is accurate and they dont like it….but whatever.

          • Xodis

            Also it could be I never heard any of that information, probably because no one cares about Hobbit/LotR except you it seems.

          • Austin Becht

            Except it won’t be, because a) a lot of FW rules are balanced. See WH30k.

            b) The rules are being handled by two GW designers who are fans of the game. We’ve already received news of what the game will be like. Basically, it’ll just be a re-balancing of the current rules. Very, VERY, minor changes. AKA, it will stay a very solid ruleset, and remain the most balanced game GW produces.

          • Xodis

            See thats the thing though, just doing a rules “polish” is a waste of effort unless they are really pushing the LotR/Hobbit franchise. This is just a half-cocked which is even more of a waste. At least if it was a strong push people could justify it them making a real attempt.

          • Austin Becht

            The rules only need a polish, but some of the units need a complete redo. A lot of the new book is mostly to compile all the Hobbit stuff together in one book, as well add in the new units and armies, such as the Iron Hills Dwarves and Azog’s Army from the Bo5A.

          • Xodis

            So answer me this, could this rulebook reinvigorate the LotR/Hobbit miniature line? Like seriously bring it back to light, or this just going to be a cool thing for some peeps thats already play it?

          • Austin Becht

            The MODELS, being released MONTHLY, like it was when they were releasing stuff for the original films, will MOST DEFINITELY reinvigorate the line. The rules are ALREADY regarded as the MOST BALANCED and BEST rules GW has EVER produced./

            Oh and, as a note, they are already planning to do Hobbit releases monthly, once the first releases come out.

          • Xodis

            Most balanced by GW standards is like the winner of a hot dog eating contest, even if you win, you’re still a loser.

          • Austin Becht

            Its not most balanced by just GW standards. Its actualy an incredibly balanced game. I play plenty of GW and non-GW games, and LoTR/Hobbit is by far the most balanced of all of the games I play.

          • Xodis

            Then why isn’t it the “Go To” game unlike Warmahordes, Infinity, KoW, etc…

          • Austin Becht

            Because little to no support and improper handling during the Hobbit movies killed a lot of interest in the game.

            But hey, at NOVA this year, Hobbit had more players then all three of those games (individually, not combined).

          • Matthew Pomeroy

            cost and finecast didnt help.

          • Matthew Pomeroy

            its a matter of opinion either way until it happens.

  • georgelabour

    at long last. UNLEASH THE WAR PIGGY!

  • JP

    It’s time for another….
    Good Idea, Bad Idea.

    Good Idea: Investing More Money in Your Best Selling Product.

    Bad Idea: Investing More Money in Your Worst Selling Product.

    • Austin Becht

      Good idea: Invest in an extremely popular IP that has a flourishing community in several areas around the world, and make up for your previous mistakes of mishandling it during the Hobbit trilogy.

      Bad idea: Not investing in the good idea.

      • Xodis

        So you agree they should invest in 40K more and actually fix it. Glad we are all on the right track.

        • John McConnell

          If you think that lack of time and money spent on 40K by GW is why it needs work, you have been ignoring their recent track record of bad decisions. While the rules for 40K have gone through multiple revisions, satisfying few, they’ve effectively killed their Fantasy games, and shut down everything else. How many game companies sell just ONE game system? Not too many. They wisely have seen what the LotR/Hobbit SBG community was doing with ZERO support, and saw an opportunity to profit from that loyalty at a minimal investment.

          • Xodis

            No it was obviously their leadership and company direction of “more is better regardless of what it does to the game.” What it needs is the same amount of dedication and effort with this new leadership that has happily listened and given fans what they wanted.
            -AoS’ biggest complaint was a lack of a balancing mechanism outside of a player conversation, thats exactly what we got.
            -Fans have always asked for a more vocal GW with a social media presence, thats exactly what we got.
            -Fans are asking for a better, streamlined, BALANCED version of 40K, thats exactly what they need to give, and it will benefit them much more than the Hobbit ever could IMO. Ill take any bet that says otherwise.

          • John McConnell

            Making changes to 40K to improve its position in the marketplace doesn’t preclude them from applying resources to other games as well. They’ve only cut, cut, cut over the past years, with their only growth area being 40K and its variants. The team devoted to 40K knows 40K, and the Middle Earth Team knows Middle Earth. There are few that could be moved from one to the other, or in fact, would they want to. 40K needs work regardless of what they do with the Hobbit. And in the past 2 years where essentially nothing has been invested in The Hobbit/LotR, has 40K improved at all? No? So does adding 3 people to work on Middle Earth change that for better or worse if none of them came from the 40K team?

          • Xodis

            Its not just about people and what they can do, its about furthering more invested capital into a game that probably wont see a return much less a gain. Its just another chess move thats going to cost GW money, which in turn will probably end up hampering AoS and more importantly 40K, as GW decides to play it safe and release even more Space Marine crap, because its capital they can count on.
            Again, 40K didn’t improve because of the old leadership and their direction in moving it forward, it has nothing to do with the amount of focus it has received.

          • John McConnell

            That’s your opinion only, and even you used “probably” twice there. I’m thinking that GW is finally looking at the long-term potential of Middle Earth-themed gaming, and has seen that it has actually been growing recently without them having invested a penny into it. By appealing to this existing audience, and keeping the additions within the relatively small scope of the Specialist Games banner, they can run a profitable division of the company. Will it be as profitable as 40K is per the amount spent on it? It’s possible, as there is a huge audience for Middle Earth toys and games, as Lego and Electronic Arts have amply shown.

          • Xodis

            Of course its my opinion, and of course I would HAVE to use probably since we have ZERO numbers to quote. What we can base an opinion on is media presence, which in the wargaming community Hobbit has very little. Yes Lego and EA showed an audience for Middle Earth toys/games….during the original Trilogy. The Hobbit movies practically ruined the franchise in a way even the Star Wars prequels couldn’t, and as a fan this saddens me.
            If you honestly believe LotR/Hobbit can be as profitable as 40K though, please share whatever you are smoking lol.

          • John McConnell

            And it has zero presence because GW screwed up. It had a good thing going in 2012, and decided to jack their prices up substantially and release very new product, at the same time the new films weren’t doing as well for unrelated reasons. They paid to renew the licence but did essentially nothing with it. Not a great investment. BUT! There is an inherent fanbase for LOTR outside of the tabletop gaming community that GW has barely touched, and did a poor job of reaching out to over the past 15 years. People will play Middle Earth-themed games who have never tried any other because they love the stories. I’ve seen this with computer games, and to some extent, with their existing game. BTW, the Lego releases of LOTR models actually didn’t begin until well after the movies came out, roughly at the time of the Hobbit movies, and their sales were not affected – they are extremely popular. GW just needs to find a way to tap into that popularity through alternative packaging, introductory sets, and possibly selling through more mainstream stores other than just their own. I wouldn’t bet against it if they market it properly. It has a MUCH greater broad appeal than 40K due to the general public being much more aware of it.

          • Xodis

            Fantasy always falls short compared to sci-fi, and no, it doesn’t have the broader range. You would be surprised how many people recognize 40K outside the tabletop world. Also the IP is done, with both the LotR and Hobbit movies finished there IP is just going to get stale and wither with a game or two here and there. The Computer games and Legos are successful mainly because the computer games are good (Shadows of Mordor) and Lego always sells, even the Lego Friends versions sell really well (I know as they are hard to find for my daughter). Its selling not because of LotR, but because its Lego.
            Again, even with proper marketing I highly doubt this game even comes close to the success of 40K. Even if it could, whats not going to do it is just a new book and a couple models everyone once in awhile. Even if its entirely possible and all your hopes and dreams come true, this is a half cocked attempt at it that cant succeed like you want it to. So again, its just wasting money.

          • John McConnell

            Well, I don’t actually care if it is a success to your standard or not. I have tons of models and like the rules as they are now. I don’t need it to be more successful, though i would like it to be, because I think it’s a well-written rules set, and it has a great miniature line – one of the best out there despite being 15 years old in many cases. I believe that it COULD be extremely successful for GW, certainly much more than it has been. I’m not arguing that it will be more successful for them than 40K, only that the LotR brand has a far greater potential than they have realized up until now. I just used the EA games and Lego as examples. There is attire, jewelry, weapons, calendars, you name it, with the Lord of the Rings/Hobbit logo on it, and even though it’s 15 years old, it is still selling well. It’s almost as bad as Star Wars – it never goes away. In the end, GW is making the call, and they probably will continue to sink money into it if it meets its financial targets. If it doesn’t, the experiment will end, which I think will be a shame.

          • Xodis

            Nor should you, you should hope that its a financial success for GW though, otherwise regardless of what you own, finding players for the game will be the problem.
            Nostalgia will always sell though, that doesn’t mean its a good investment, especially with something as demanding as a tabletop wargame. No one can even say how well Xwing or the other Star Wars games would sell if they were not so easy to get involved in.

          • John McConnell

            And getting into it is the one problem I have with it following a Forge World model: expensive, not in stores, and only available in limited numbers. That’s great for people like me who are already invested in the game, but does little for creating new customers because visibility is going to be so low. It is very much reliant on word of mouth, an unsure and slow way to get new customers. They have yet to address whether they will be bringing it back into the shops – which is a HUGE remaining question. Unless they are changing their approach and expectations, and have decided that all of their games don’t have to be best-sellers, it probably won’t last. But if GW decides that they only need to maintain a specific profit margin on this, and that they really only need to reach some new customers whose money they otherwise would not have, it may get by without major marketing expenses, which would be needed to entice the non-wargaming LOTR/Hobbit fans to the game..

          • Hawt Dawg

            They also have a huge range of miniatures they can sell if they manage to keep a fire going (because you know, meat is back on the menu…).

            This is one game, like Konflikt 47, that I wish people around me played.

  • Rainthezangoose

    I for one am bloody very happy to hear this as I personally think that BSG > 40k. And I LOVE me some 40K.

    I think besides obviously new models at BETTER prices the only thing on my wish list really, would be a re-vap of the Siege rules, Its probably the only thing that I dislike about the current hobbit rules. Its just inferior to the rules in the LoTR rulebook.

  • Big Red

    One thing that I personally am looking forward to is using this as an excuse to try and get a bunch of people I know that fell out of wargaming back in. The battle games in middle earth magazine was hugely popular around my age group and area, so being able to say that they are bringing out new things will hopefully help get these guys back in.

  • Drahazar

    Well this could be could since AoS is dead at all 3 local gaming stores. And the hobbit and lord of the rings games had really good balanced rules. AoS should have used that rule set maybe people would actually play it. All that’s played fantasy wise is 9th age and KoW.

  • zemlod

    If that house actually does hit the shelves eventually, I’ll buy multiples. LotR is the one game that I actually meet regular opponents to play against 🙂

  • Satyan Patel

    I just need that Lake town house and scene stuff for Frostgrave and Bolt Action. Could use it in other skirmish games too. 🙂