40K-AoS: We Need Another “Cross Over” Army

Why do Chaos Daemons get to have all the fun? How about another army that we can use in BOTH AoS & 40K?

For the longest time Warhammer 40k and Warhammer Fantasy were rumored to be based in the same galaxy or setting. The early Realm of Chaos books like Lost and the Damned and Slaves to Darkness did little to hide this – especially when you had things like Plasma weapons as “mutations” and the Origin of the Emperor in the books…

Fast forward to now. It still seems like both game settings still have a common thread and that thread is the Warp/Chaos. And the beings that live in the Warp (Chaos Daemons) have been the one army that has been allowed to cross over from both systems…for now! I think it’s time Games Workshop added another army with some cross over appeal. Hey, we’re all on round bases now, right?! So here’s our list of 5 armies we’d like to see with rules for BOTH systems.

Seraphon

These guys are a stones throw away from 40k as it is – lets look at their lore:

  • Slann are basically powerful Psykers
  • They can travel in Space
  • They are servants of the Old Ones

Not good enough? Okay, well how about we take a look at their rules really quick. The Saurus Guard for example:

Check their full rules HERE.

Notice anything odd? No? Look at those Keywords closely.

Yeah – They are Daemons now. ORDER Daemons. #JustSayin

Kharadron Overlords

I know a lot of folks were already thinking about these models as… you guessed it: Squats! To be fair, I can’t really blame them. Why? Well, aside from the fact that they are all in high-tech armor, have based their society on science, and can travel among the mortal realms – look at some of the early sketches from the rumored Demiurg Race:

I, for one, welcome the Kharadron Overlords as a viable army for both 40k and AoS!

Skaven

The Skaven are 1/2 way there already! How? Well, the Horned Rat dethroned/usurped power away from Slaanesh. So at what point does the Horned Rat become the 4th (or 5th if you’re still counting Slaanesh) Chaos God? On top of that – Plague Monks:

These guys are basically chaos cultists for Nurgle already. “But those models are old!” Yes, which is why this would be a perfect time to update them. Maybe to look more thematically appropriate:

You can’t tell me the Stormfiends wouldn’t be at home on a 40k table with round bases. LOOK AT THEM!

Plus, we already know that the Skaven have “Rocket Tech” and have probably communicated with the Eldar already. Google “Farsqueaker” – it’s canon. (Thanquol, The End Times Volume IV)

Exodites

Who rides Cold Ones, uses Eldar Tech, and has already made appearances in 40k? Exodites! This army would be awesome as a cross over force. I’d finally get to have the Dino-Riders Army I’ve always wanted…

Look at this awesome Fan Conversion! C’mon!!!

Lore-wise, I’ll admit this one probably doesn’t make a TON of sense. No, I’m going based on pure aesthetics. Also, because the Exodites are just “high-tech” enough they could thematically work in either setting, which is why they would make a great cross over army. Calvary on Cold Ones. Ancient Eldar close-combat and missile weapons. Eldar riding flying Lizards…It could work! Keep in mind we are all still hoping for a re-launch of the Elves from AoS and no one is really sure the thematic direction GW will go with that one.

Tyranids

This one, I think, works a little too well. It works so well, a fan-made codex popped up in support of the idea!

But really think about it:

  • A Threat from Beyond
  • Insatiable Hunger
  • Hivemind culture

If you’ve ever wanted to mix in a little Cthulhu with your Warhammer then the Tyranids are the way to go. On top of that, a lot of the art work wants to show them getting into melee and clawing/smashing/slashing their way to that tasty-tasty biomass. The Mortal Realms seems like a wonderful fit – it’s got lots of Biomass to devour and folks tend to favor getting up close and personal to do their fighting.

Bonus: Necrons as Tomb Kings

It was a real shame to see this model go. I really do think that Games Workshop could find a way to merge the Necrons and Tomb Kings into an army that could cross over from 40k to AoS. The Necron Warriors are a little dated so why not update the kit with some Melee Weapon options?

Why couldn’t there be some Tomb World in the Mortal Realms floating around lifelessly? Any number of things could trigger it and it would hum to life with activity. Maybe during the Necrontyr vs Old Ones war a fleet got lost, cut off from the rest of the Necrontyr it just went dormant. GW has an entire room of writers that can make it work. So C’mon GW – Make it happen!

 

What army do you think would be a good candidate as a new “Cross Over” army? Let us know in the comments below!

  • Talos2

    No. nothing fits. Not as armies anyway.

    • Bayne MacGregor

      Slaan were in 1st ed 40k already. So they’d just be coming back.

      • ikari_kun2002

        They were skinnier then.
        Most of us were, I think.

        • el_tigre

          Laughs … … … cries.

      • Knight_of_Infinite_Resignation

        Agree. Slann were great, they filled a gap in the fluff as the creators of the younger races and first enemies of the Necrontyr.

        They would fill a niche in game play too, I imagine them being fast and fragile like Dark Eldar, but protected by energy fields (invulnerable saves) like LotD, whilst being strongly psychic like Grey Knights. I think it would be cool if they had really odd objectives, or tools to manipulate the objectives, to reflect their control of causality and their enigmatic nature.

        Stylistically they could look like WHFB Slann, but with a few guns like they had in RT, and use flying temple fragments and psychic powers to move around instead of vehicles.

        • euansmith

          And they could have Fear Zoats as a USR.

    • Old zogwort

      The best option in my mind would be a faction of feral shipwreck survivor descendants. Becoming a new faction for AoS and 40k at the same time.

    • TheMawr

      Not as direct crossovers at least (as chaos demons are, and even there I dont think it works )

  • Nick Silver

    I think AoS needs some space mari… oh wait!

    • Knight_of_Infinite_Resignation

      yeah, aren’t Sigmarines and Custodes the new crossover army?

    • Brettila

      Actually, Stormcasts shoot and save better than marines.

  • Raven Jax

    I would totally be on board with literally any of these.

    • Robert Thornton-Kaye

      See my comment elsewhere in this thread for details of the Fantasy armies I’ve been converting into 40K. Which armies would you be most interested in?

  • EnTyme

    I’m already using Nagash as a C’tan Shard of the Nightbringer.

  • JTD7445

    I’d love to try AoS, if I could use my Nids!

    • J Mad

      yeah after thinking about it for a bit, Nids be great, and playable!

  • uatu13

    GW would be crazy if they didn’t make a Squats codex for the new Kharadron Overlord models!

    • vlad78

      A bit too 19th century for squats imho.

    • Ryan C

      The challenge with squats is the same challenge that GW has with chaos dwarves and sister of battle. Everyone is constantly clamouring for them but in reality very few relative players would actually end up building an army of them if GW did invest in them.

      (Though notice how GW is testing the waters with Sisters doing things like made to order or Celestine to see what the demand is like before committing to a full new range)

      • uatu13

        Yeah, but this would be an easy move for them since the army is already popular for another game system. That’s sort of the point for being able to use an army for both systems.

        • Ryan C

          I’d disagree on that, the Overlords are very steampunk, They don’t fit in 40k. Squats would need to be a completely separate range even if some of the themes are retained.

          • uatu13

            And why wouldn’t steampunk fit in as a new style for 40K? We have styles that are all over the place currently (egyptian necrons, anime tau, colorful daemons, techno mechanicum, etc). If there was a new faction it would have to be unique, and this is definitely the case with the Kharadron Overlords.

          • Ryan C

            Personally I would be VERY disappointed in GW if they put Steam Punk into 40k. In my opinion it doesn’t fit into the theme or the concept of a science fiction advanced setting at all. It wouldn’t be all that far, in my mind, from adding in black powder with canons and muskets.

          • uatu13

            People said the same thing when Tau came out because they basically look like anime mecha. Fortunately, most people are more open to different art styles of different armies, or 40K would be a very boring gaming world!

          • Ryan C

            I never had issue with Tau at all. They feel like they fit in the universe while still being a distinctly different race. Eldar aren’t diesel punk either, they also fit.

            But Steam powered blimps with propellors and harpoon guns? Guns that look like Blunderbusses and Muskets? Nope. Just nope.

          • uatu13

            So basically you’re just offering your opinion on what you feel is acceptable for certain styles, and unacceptable for others. You’re free to have your opinion, but I”m not sure why anyone else should share it without any objective evidence to back your position up.

          • Ryan C

            Of course, I never made any suggestion that it was anything other than opinion. There will never be any objective evidence to back up a subjective opinion.

            That said? How do you write rules for technology that is so radically far behind everyone else’s that it would be trivial in an actual battle. It would quite literally be Intergalactic races 40,000 years into the future vs Squats with technology wouldn’t even stand up against a modern day military? Write it all off as “magic”?

            Fortunately, I’m about 98% sure GW agrees with me and has no intention of putting Steam Punk into 40k.

          • uatu13

            There’s a big difference in guys armed with bows and spears, and guys with metal airships powered by a strange glowing energy source, metal space suits, and bizarre guns that look nothing like something that would be used in a fantasy setting. A lot of the mechanicum weapons don’t look that different from the guns used by the Kharadron Overlords (look at skitarii rangers, transuranic aquerbus, and the pistols used by the tech priests). Hell, the leader guy for the Overlords has a frickin’ chainsword.

            Guess you have to have an ounce of imagination, or nothing would seem plausible in the 40K universe.

          • Ryan C

            You can always write off a way to put anything into the story and have it sorta fit. Hell GW could decide they want to add power puff girls to the story and come up with some story to fit it in. The question is: Does it fit thematically into the art style and improve the setting? My opinion is that it doesn’t. I feel it would vastly cheapen the 40k art style.

            When I look at the Overlords I see a race that represents a significantly “advanced” society within the context of a medieval setting. They fit in nicely representing the technological pinnacle within that setting.

            Ultimately we will prob never agree on this, but to me Overlords in 40k would lower my respect for the setting and the story. Like I said though, I’d almost certainly say that GW feels the same and that we won’t be seeing any Steampunk in 40k in the foreseable future. (Just like we won’t be seeing any super advanced robots or technology in AoS even though it would be easy to write fluff for some alien race discovering the realms as it travelled through the warp)

          • ikari_kun2002

            As opposed to 40K, the core style of which is dieselpunk?

          • euansmith

            Indeed. And the art style has evolved over the decades.

            Personally I like the early days when everything was in flux; Rogue Trader featured a artwork from about a dozen different artists.

            Plus, as 40k is supposed to span much of the galaxy, there should be a huge range of technologies and societies on display.

      • Keith Wilson

        i guarantee a proper redo of the squats would be a cash windfall for GW …. no doubt in my mind

        • Ryan C

          If Squats sold well back in the day they would never have been discontinued. I think you’d have a few hardcore squats enthusiasts buying into them but for your average player? Probably low interest.

          • Knight_of_Infinite_Resignation

            there is enough interest for Mantic to make them (and continue to make them) a cornerstone of their Sci-Fantasy range.

          • Ryan C

            Fair enough, but then again Mantic is a much smaller entity so releases are a way smaller investment, it has a different audience, and a different universe.

            Just because X-Wing is successful doesn’t mean Battlefleet Gothic returning would also be.

            I would really surprised if GW isn’t constantly evaluating whether a “dwarf” 40k release would be worth their cost (both in terms of capital investment and opportunity loss in lieu of doing something else) and until now their conclusion is that it isnt.

          • Knight_of_Infinite_Resignation

            I think Mantic’s success with squats shows that there is an otherwise untapped demand. Their models are nowhere near as nice as GWs would be but enough people want to buy them. I think Mantic know their stuff, they are all ex GW industry professionals, if they thought there was little demand they wouldn’t have included them in their range. I think in proportion to their turnover the cost of a plastic range is probably more of a risk for Mantic than GW.

            I agree with you over BFG, but I think X-Wing’s success is due to several good design decisions, prepaints, simple but deep gameplay, low barrier to entry, good IP. GW could do well with BFG, but only if they took some leaves from FFG’s book.

          • Brettila

            Never even seen them in a box…

        • ikari_kun2002

          I doubt GW could make much money on squats, but it could still be a windfall for them, and here’s how:
          White Dwarf. Put squat rules and conversion guides in the magazine, and thus sell Kharadron models to people who have or can get Genestealer Cults spares.
          Similarly, bring back Lost and Damned! (In White Dwarf.) Then you could sell a few Skaven kits to 40K players, at trivial development cost.

  • Desmond Burke

    Holy Crap a Deathrattle army using Necrons….

  • ikari_kun2002

    Seraphon + Grimdark = Tyranid.

  • Kevin Glasgow

    And they could sell a crap load of codices for the new armies before they flush it all with 8th edition. They still have time…

  • Cylux

    I suppose when you have a setting where crossbows that fire lightning bolts are a thing then adding laser rifles wouldn’t really tip the balance that much.

  • Siruswraith

    In favor of the Skaven, the Samus Forgeworld model is just a little too ratlike for its own good.

    https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-US/Samus-Daemon-Prince-of-the-Ruinstorm

  • Heinz Fiction

    GW should bring Tyranids to AoS. Finally they’d be in game which sucks as much as they do.

    • Akorav

      XD death to the false warhammer and all of his slaves!

  • Kinsman

    I think Tyranids would work best. Would make sense, I think, more than the rest.

  • ieyke

    Lizardmen and the new airship dwarves were the only good ideas.

    Is this article written under the impression that the Exodites are a Fantasy army?
    It sure seems like it.
    They’re not. At all.
    They don’t “make appearances in 40k”.
    They’re a 40k army. 40k is the entirety of where they exist.

    It’s hard to decide if Tyranids or Necrons is the worst suggestion.
    The two most dangerous factions in the entire 40k universe…..vs a planet of scrubs with swords and bows/arrows….
    The Fantasy world would be Tyranid lunch in a matter of DAYS.
    There’s NOTHING they could do to stop Necrons. They can barely handle regular rotting undead that are falling apart on their own accord. The weakest Necron is more dangerous and indestructible than a Space Marine. They manipulate time and space, and use the laws of physics as a toy….

    Skaven in 40k isn’t a TERRIBLE idea, but it raises the big obvious question of where the hell the Skaven and their god have been all this time in the 40k universe, and why are they only just now showing up?
    Also, they’d be comedically weak. Rats with no armor, no chitinous hide, nothing. It’s like an army of Grots.
    Skaven work in Fantasy because they’re fighting squishy regular humans in terrible armor, and weak fantasy orcs, and squishy elves.
    If you’re trying to make these “crossover” armies work as-is, then the Skaven are hilariously outmatched by regular Imperial Guardsmen and Tau Fire Warriors.

    If you start modifying Skaven by giving them armor and space weapons, or you start giving Exodites primitive weaponry, then you’ve totally missed the point of a crossover army being compatible between systems.

    Lizardmen work because they’ve already got the whole “technology so advanced it look like magic” thing going on, and they’re already a part of the 40k universe. But even if all their melee weapons are secretly Power Weapons…..they sure don’t look like it. Honestly, even Lizardmen need redesigning to make sense in 40k.

    The dwarves are basically Power Armored mini Space Marines.
    Just pretend their armor and guns are more powerful than they are and you’re good to go.
    They’re basically reinvented Squats as it is.

    • Mr.Custodes

      You do realise Skaven were in 40k? They were the Hrud before the retcon. There’s an article about it on War of Sigmar.

      • ieyke

        Not really, no.
        Hrud were never defined or even really described. People just assumed they were Space Skaven based on slight similarities.

      • Skaven are servants of a warp entity, hrud are just xenos

  • ZeeLobby

    Might as well at this point. Neither has fluff/writing that would really suffer the combo at this point.

    • GnomesForge

      Strange way to treat your “most important asset”. The sacred IP that is that did launch a thousand cease and desists to preserve its glory. If anyone’s going to ruin it, it’s going to be GW themselves dammit.

  • Robert Thornton-Kaye

    Lol! Funnily enough I’m actually making these crossovers already. Been working on them for years. I’m currently doing the vampire counts codex. If you’re interested come over to the Fandexes group on Facebook to be informed of each one as it comes out: https://www.facebook.com/groups/fandexes/ . Although I’ve been working on them for years their final versions are only just being made as we had to go through a lot of ideas on how to make magic work in 40K. Here’s the latest version of the skaven codex to give you some idea as to how it works: https://www.dropbox.com/s/k03vq7j99qwvi6w/Codex%20Skaven231216.pdf?dl=0

  • …no

  • Flan man

    The reason they have the deamon keyword, is they are the memories of the Last Great Battle, created by the slann. They are not actually deamons.

  • Mr.Fister

    I do not even giva a s… dudah-dudah there is already too much stuff dudah-dudah too much stuff too much stuff dudah-dudah-eyy

  • marxlives

    When you get that much crossover, Sigmarines, and with both 40k and AoS getting a complete uniform and vanilla-fiction of rules, are you really playing a different game. What makes AoS different from 40k other than the assumption that one is sci-fi because of its name and the other is fantasy because of its name. If this is happening or a indication of the future the end of 8th will just be the push and merger of 40k players into AoS players. Pretty smart on GW’s part. Why support two systems?

    • af

      Yeah, agreed. I truly don’t understand some fans. Why would you even want such a convergence of both games’ lore and/or miniatures? What is there to be gained? Why not keep both games separate and distinct? If anything I think 40K should strive to separate even more from its WHFB In Space origins.

  • Deathwing

    The problem is that there are no other armies that utilize so little tech that they make sense in AOS but are completely justifiable in 40k.
    The goal here is not just army rules but models that can be used in both as well. Exodites would have to be severely low tech/crystal tech/ etc and new elves severely high tech looking for AOS with the same look to get away with using the same models and be convincing for both systems. I guess it would be possible if you designed an entire range for elves and used like 3 units as cross over for Exodites that are meant to work with normal craftworld eldar/harlaquines/Aldere.

    • Brettila

      Skaven make good chaos dudes with a bit of work. I knew a guy who built a Nurgle Rat-Marine army. It used all beakie heads.

  • piglette

    Skaven as an alien under the Tau Empire would be cool. Perhaps lizardmen too.

    • ikari_kun2002

      If that’s what it has to be, I’m fine with it, but I’d rather have new, never seen armies as Tau auxilia, and Skaven as a Chaos thing. I’d also like to see plastic Vespid and a completed plastic Kroot range, with the option to de-Tau them and use them as mercenaries with other armies.

      • piglette

        I’d support those things as well. I’m one of those people who find Kroot very interesting and vanilla Tau totally uninteresting. Unfortunately, there just isn’t enough Kroot to make me collect them.

        • Robert Thornton-Kaye

          We’ve got rules for kroot mercs and skaven in the Fandexes group on FB if you’d like to have a look.

  • King Renegado

    ….is nobody going to address the fact that if Tyranids showed up in a fantasy setting the planet would be nommed in a matter of hours?
    If a heavily fortified imperial fortress world falls to Tyranids, I am certain that the medieval 40k world wouldn’t stand a chance.

    • Tothe

      Chaos hasn’t taken over either though. And order is apparently making headway now in AoS.

  • Mr.psyker

    This is propaganda! They are going to not only Sigmarize 40k, but they are going to put sigmare in your 40k with your sigmar on your 40k… this is juuuuust great!!!!

  • Christian Zajac

    Exodites in 40k would be neat, but I don’t see how they could be competitive unless you massively buffed their dinos and psykers, since the whole point of Exodites is that they’re low-tech. Hrud (Space Skaven) and Demiurg (Space Dorfs) would be my preferred new armies though.

    Yes, I know Squats were the original Space Dorfs, but I think Demiurg work better.

  • Tothe

    Mantic already makes Space Dwarves and Space Rats. There’s a definite gamer interest in those factions. The new Steampunk GW Dwarfs with minor model changes could be fine in a sci-fi setting.

    I don’t really see Nids crossing over into fantasy. And I fear Tomb Kings are completely done.

  • Golden Yak

    I don’t know that I’d want armies portrayed as actually existing in both universes, like having a 40k Necron Tomb-World somehow connect with the Mortal Realms, or having Tyranids invade Ghyran or things of that kidney.

    I know that daemons and the Chaos Gods are in both settings, but I always imagined them as being same characters but existing in separate continuities. The WFB/AoS Slaanesh was not born of the eldar like the 40k incarnation was, for example.

    Rather, I wouldn’t mind having armies like the daemons that are capable of existing in both settings. Like orruks and orks. Kharadron Overlords would, with a little conversion, fit right in to 40k, but as a demiurg or squat faction, not literally the Overlords themselves crossing over from the Mortal Realms into the Imperium or something like that.

    I think one potential faction that could be done in such a way would be the skaven of Clan Skryre. They’re the source of the advanced tech the skaven use, if they got a level of tech comparable to the Karadron, they could also be portrayed as fitting in both as skaven in Mortal Realms and some xenos race in 40k – perhaps a xenos devoted to Chaos, as I don’t think we actually have one of those as an official army. Call them the Skitterkin or something, have them devoted to some minor Chaos power of dark technology, maybe build them into hated enemies of the Mechanicum. Warp-powered lightning guns, Stormfiend-variants, power-armored Verminators, personal doomwheel/hamster-ball bike-vehicles… yes-yes, I can see it all now…

    Glory to Great Horned Rat!

    • euansmith

      The Warp could be the membrane between the two separate Universes, AoS on one side, and 40k on the other; so that things from the Warp could intrude in to both Universes.

      • Golden Yak

        Mmmnyeah, it *could* be, but that isn’t my issue. It’s not that I don’t think there could be a direct cross-over, it’s that I don’t *want* there to be a direct cross-over.

  • Eldar are Chaos now

    Aspect warriors could easily be a multi kit for AOS aelf army and 40k elder. You can do a plastic for each aspect and still have them multipart.
    You guys are thinking waaaaay to literally when you see crossovers. GW is ahead of you on this one.

  • onlyonepinman

    SIGMARINES! Especially with all that silly boltgun/crossbow nonsense that they have going on.

  • Kostas Pap Gus

    IMO they shouldn’t be any Orcs in 40K. It is a low intelligence race and just don’t fit in sci-fi.

  • GnomesForge

    So typical. We just got squats and now people are asking for a 3rd niche army. How bout you do my exodites? Those actually would fit in both. Wood elf it up GW!