40K Editorial: Embrace the Horror

It is a time for change and 8th edition Warhammer 40,000 is nearly upon us.

It has been an interesting month for me, gaming-wise.  I’ve found myself in uncharted territory.  What I mean is, I’m normally pretty upbeat about new game elements, factions or whatever in my games, particularly 40k.  But this has not been the case with the coming new edition of 40k.  I’ve resisted.  I’ve protested.  I’ve argued.  And I’ve generally been pretty negative about it.

For example, see my last article here.  And I even carried this attitude with me to my local Games Workshop (GW) store when last I visited (and where I’m sure I seemed far more unhinged and less persuasive then in that last article).  All in all, this has really left a bad taste in my mouth and I’ve really felt out of sorts.  It’s forced a tad bit of introspection upon me and I’m left wondering one question.  Why?  Why have I been so opposed to the new oncoming edition?

I hear they’re delicious…

It’s a complex question, once I really try to answer it — or is it?  At first I thought the answer was obvious.  GW just gave the Thousand Sons (my favorites since 1989) their first and only real spotlight of their own — new rules, models, spells, daemon Primarch, the whole shebang — and then a mere six months later they pull the rug out from under me and POW!  It all goes away.  The same could be said of chaos space marines (CSMs) in general — and I AM a Chaos guy — with the launch of Traitor Legions.  We finally get respectable rules, and just like that, GW yanks them away.

They are actually walking backwards, you just can’t tell in this artwork.

But is that what is really happening?  Do I really believe they’d just take it all away, just like that?  The jaded CSM player me says “yes.”  But … the super awesome Thousand Sons models are still there, Magnus at the forefront, and I just can’t believe that.  In addition, the hints we’ve seen so far of Chaos on the ascendancy once again and the galactic map GW leaked that shows the Planet of the Sorcerers in realspace now say otherwise.  There is a real feeling in the air, that this time, Chaos won’t be forgotten.

We still don’t believe you.  You’re gonna make us suck again.

So then I thought, perhaps it’s because this edition, despite all my warnings a couple years back and the denials that GW would never do such a thing, is basically an adapted version of Age of Sigmar (AOS).  And make no mistake, this new edition of 40k will be basically an AOS 2.0.  But aside from feeling lied to and being maligned for being ‘ultimately’ right (hey, I am a prophet of Tzeentch after all), what does this matter?

If I’m honest with myself, and I’ve been forcing myself to be, my problems with AOS have all largely been fixed.  GW put points back into the system, they’ve added depth back to (some) factions with the new faction books such as the Disciples of Tzeentch book and they’ve really reigned in the abusiveness by imposing points-costs on formations and imposing restrictions on summoning.  It really is a new GW, indeed, and I’ve mostly been impressed with the overall decisions they as a company have been making lately.

Just look at the General’s Handbook for example.  A yearly book that fixes and updates all armies, with an aim at correcting overpowered issues that crop up?  That’s an amazing and so, so welcome change.  And it doesn’t stop there.  They are listening to us.  The players.  Yes, us.  And they gathered to them people (players) to help playtest and hash out issues before they release the games to us, and then again in those yearly updates.  It’s so amazing, I’m not sure I really believe it.  Of course, that’s probably just the CSM player in me talking again.

Yes, of course CSMs will be great again.  Trust me, I’d never lie to you.

So if it’s not kicking CSMs while we’re down again or the AOSization of the whole system, then what is it?  What’s bothering me?  Is it that GW is blowing up everything and all my books are becoming obsolete again?  Naahhh…  I’m been playing a long time, I’m used to this.  I get it.  Books become obsolete and the game marches on.  Besides, GW is apparently putting all the dataslates for every unit in the game online for free when the game launches next month (which, while this doesn’t impress me, I’m sure thrills all you kids who play now).

Even more importantly, they’ve promised to drop three faction books that contain all this material at that time as well that’ll be reasonably priced for guys like me that must have it in printed form.  Based upon what similar books were priced at when AOS launched, this means that the players should be able to replace every codex in the game in this new edition for about $100 or so total (or even less if you’re like me and refuse to soil your fingers with the Imperial book).  That softens the blow quite a bit and makes me feel a lot less salty.

Current codexes role-playing the transition to 8th edition.

Despite all this, I don’t really feel any of these is the real reason I’ve been so resistant to change.  Talking with my brother, as I always do, he thinks that it’s because I really like choice and customization.  I am after all the guy that refuses to field a character that is the same to any other in my army, names all my characters and really tries my best to make sure units are armed, outfitted or just different than all the others in my army (where I can).  7th edition 40k allowed for such flourishes perhaps more than any other edition except maybe 1st edition.

Looking at AOS as a template in this regard, such choice will likely be severely curtailed in 8th edition in favor of streamlining.  This seems very true, with my Thousand Sorcerers likely dropping down from the choice of 70 or so spells each to just a few dictated options.  I’ll miss that aspect of the game, so my brother is probably right there.  But, that too, doesn’t feel like enough.  Ultimately, I’m not really sure what it was.  I just know that I was wrong.

I’ve been deceived, my eyes cloaked with lies.

But I see truly now, and I’ve chosen to embrace the horror.  I no longer fear the future.  I welcome it.

It took me a while.  I’m stubborn, I guess.

A Great Epiphany

Even amid all these swirling thoughts, the gaming must go on.  So with the impending 8th edition looming on the horizon, I decided to do something I never do — play a tournament with an unpainted army.  Despite being a Thousand Sons player, I’m a pretty slow painter, so my current version of the army is still mostly unpainted.  I also figured this would be my last chance to play with Magnus’ current rules, so despite him being only partially painted as well, I decided to make him the star of the show.  So I threw together an army crammed with Exalted Sorcerers on discs (they’re gonna look so bad-ass once I paint them) headed up my Magnus himself and marched to war.

It was a small tournament at our local GW store run by a buddy of mine (Hail Tzeentch, Aaron!), but it was still an ITC tournament and what I’d call very competitive.  Of course, there’s nothing wrong with being competitive, and I genuinely think Magnus is a pretty powerful and competitive unit as well, but I just wasn’t feeling it.  Despite two of my opponents being great guys that I always have a great time with, I just felt that all the games were more of a chore than anything else.

I made this exact face when I realized how tired of 7th edition I am.

I went 1-2 in that tournament and was tabled in that last game (but only because I just had had enough and chose to land Magnus and let my Tau 8-riptide opponent blast me off the table — up until then (turn 6) he had shot everything at Magnus for 2-3 turns and yet the daemon Primarch remained unwounded).  I never mind losing, but those games really ran the gambit of how the current system so often plays out.

Game 1, I smoked my opponent.  Game 2, was a closer game, but the mission objectives were stacked against me, and I was smoked this time.  And game 3, well as I said, I was tabled.  But what I really took away from the tournament is that I’m just tired of this edition.  Every army was a specialized force that really didn’t feel like a 40k army, not even mine.  An all riptide force, an all landspeeder Dark Angel force, Magnus and four exalted sorcerers, and an Ynarri force with dark eldar characters attached to D-template-wielding wraithguard, and on and on.

The experience also reinforced upon me how tired I am of having to roll up all my psychic powers before each game — and this is that I’ve developed a card system that makes it very easy and this particular army had a rather limited number of rolls to make compared to the typical Tzeentch army I’d played during 7th edition.

The whole thing just gave me flashbacks to LVO and reminded me just how bloated 7th edition 40k really is.  I mean, I knew it was.  I knew.  I had to have.  But somehow I’d hypnotized myself into believing it was all okay.  Somewhere along the line I’d fallen victim to my own lies.  Perhaps it was because I’d worked at a GW store in the last couple years.  Or perhaps it was that I’d defended the game as okay ‘under the right circumstances’ to my brother for so long that I’d talked myself into it.

Ultimately, I do believe 7th edition was a great game when it first launched, but with the advancement of formations and the craziness of the Necron Decurion format, the game has spun totally out of control.  Somehow, I’d convinced myself that it could be fixed if they’d just turn back the clock and right those wrongs.  But you can’t put the genie back in the bottle, and I just couldn’t see that.

That tournament opened my eyes.

I see clearly now.

Me contemplating another game of 7th edition.  Stupid month of waiting for 8th…

I’m Ready

So here I am, a man completely changed in opinion.  Looking back on my whole reaction, it really doesn’t seem like that could have been me.  How did I become the guy defending the unholy bloated mess that 7th edition 40k currently has become?  Though I run with a competitive crowd now — we’re the Unbound and out of Arizona, if anyone’s interested — I’m only semi-competitive myself if I’m honest.

I try to win of course, but only on my terms.  That means I personally have to think my army’s cool and fluffy, and I often make the lesser competitive choice if that’s what I feel the army calls for.  That often means I lose.  A lot.  Still, I can surprise now and then.  But given this, how was I the guy refusing to accept the truth while all my more competitive buddies were welcoming it with open arms?  It boggles my mind.

We Unbound guys are not really as bland as this.  Well, maybe Scott…  No.  Kidding.  It’s just the Arizona landscape.

But as I’ve said, I’ve changed my mind.  I’m really looking forward to the new edition and all the tidbits GW has been doling out to us are getting me more and more excited.  While I admit that some things still fill me with a bit of trepidation, such as some of the changes to assaults that we’ve seen. In particular, the fact that everyone hits in melee on a fixed number seems to diminish the overall combat prowess of the true masters. Allowing mighty warriors such as a Bloodthirster to be hit on say a 3+ by troops that though perhaps elite in their own way, should be far less proficient against such a beast, overall I’m keen to see more.

Actually, I’d just prefer it if they release it already so that we can sink our teeth into the new edition and get the games rolling.  Honestly, I can’t muster up any enthusiasm right now to play any more 7th edition, so I can’t wait to just get started with 8th.  Sadly, it appears the course is set and there’s nothing we can do about it.  So no 40k for me for another month.  In the meantime, I guess there’s always modeling and painting to do, and perhaps some Shadow Wars as well.

We’re gonna make you beg for mercy this time.  Then, we’re gonna step on you anyway.

Given all that, I think that perhaps the most appealing change to me that we’ve seen so far is the way vehicles will play now.  While I admit to being unsure about abandoning the whole ‘armor value system of vehicles’ that prior editions used in favor of the simple ‘everything has a Toughness value now and is basically treated the same’ of this new edition, upon reflection, it really does seem for the best.

I really like the idea of vehicles not being one-shotted off the board before they can do anything.  And it’s really looking like this might be the first edition in seemingly forever that walkers might not actually suck.  I’m almost salivating at the thought of my daemon engines romping over the board and perhaps being truly feared for once.  This system change, along with the whole ‘everything can hurt everything else (in theory)’ rule and the concept of ‘diminishing stats as it takes damage’ that at least some vehicles will have, really feel like they’ll make all vehicles viable any worthwhile.  Everything depends upon point costs, of course, but I find it very encouraging indeed.

 

So what about you?  Are you looking forward to 8th edition as much as I am now?  Or are you still unsure?  If you are looking forward to it, what’s your favorite upcoming change?  And if you are still holding out, remember what I had to learn the hard way.  Resistance is futile.

Read more from Kazzigum on Slaved to Ruin

  • Koen Cambré

    I’m not too worried. My experience with AoS since GHB has been mostly very positive.

    And tbh, playing 40k just felt too clunky by now, the games took too long. The time feels right to go in a bit of a drastically new direction (but still keep the feeling/setting intact).

  • I haven’t played in 2 years. I had tried to make 40k work for me for a couple of years, but when the 7th ed Eldar Codex came out and the formation madness started I’d had enough. I’m cautiously optimistic that 8th will get me to bring my models out for some casual games. I don’t love all the rules, particularly the D6 instead of large templates, but what I’ve seen so far at least deserves a chance. So I’ll try to make 40k work for me again.

    • ZeeLobby

      Same boat. I dunno if it’s the years of disappointment and moving on to other games, or just getting older, but I just don’t really care if it works nor not anymore, lol.

      • Knight_of_Infinite_Resignation

        I am still very committed to 40K as my main game, though with rumours of AoSification on the horizon a couple of years ago I have really embraced Bolt Action and SAGA as alternatives so if I dropped 40K I wouldn’t have to drop the wargaming hobby altogether.

        I think my arc follows the author broadly (and I have to say thanks for the article, well written and well thought out, unlike much on BoLS). The first few leaks seemed really bad, I don’t like the weapons hurting everything rule and the loss of armour facings seems very bad, even though I actually advocated for years for a merging of the vehicle and MC rules.

        Thats said 40K is currently a mess, and it so difficult to teach that something must be very wrong with the core rules.

        My hope is that 8th becomes a fast flowing game, where we can use large armies and still finish games, where the format of the rules eliminates all the ‘looking up’ time which is currently so much a feature of 7th. When you’ve been playing every week since the game came out and still have to look up rules every game then something is wrong…

        I also hope that a modified version of 7th is retained for 30K. 7th has the potential to be the core of a really excellent tactical game that would suit the depth of the armies that FW have released for HH.

        So I am cautiously optimistic for 8th, yet still, paradoxically, worried for 30K.

        • ZeeLobby

          Yeah, I totally get that as well. I mean I’ve played 40K for 20 years, so I always WANT it to be the best game out there. Right now my issue is, with the simplification, and removal of a lot of the unique/fun (talking 5th edition, not 6th/7th addons), but like charts, and templates, etc. I just don’t feel like it’s worth the price tag. It doesn’t help that many other actual skirmish/squad games offer ton of depth and only require 10ish unique models to have a blast. We’re starting up Frostgrave now, and it cost me literally the price of the book, and it’s a fun system. With the fallout skirmish game on the horizon, WMH, infinity, etc. I’m just not sure how interested I am in paying a premium to put more models on the table for what, imo, is a shallower ruleset. I dunno. We’ll see. Will def play some 8th.

  • Trey

    Bought 3,4,5,6 was so disappointed with 6 that when 7 came out and doubled down on the “its not a competition meme” I just quite playing. Might try 8.

  • Defenestratus

    I like how this article starts out sounding like it comes right out of my head – and then it switches – the author goes to a tournament where the entire game is perverted into something that it should never be.

    It just solidifies my idea that the only reason people want a new edition is because of tournaments and the idiotic “competitive” scene that perverts the 40k universe into a thoroughly unpleasant experience.

    If you don’t care about winning, and all you care about is having a good time with a friend using miniatures to play out a movie in your head, then 7th is a great system.

    I hope that cinematic feel of the game is preserved. The rules I’ve seen so far don’t really give me a lot of hope.

    • Emerson Sullivan

      100% truth

    • QFT

    • Davis Centis

      I would have to say I disagree. I play in an area where we were doing a league just prior to all the news starting to roll out. The league wasn’t overly competitive, and had lots of fun low-competitive points (the Kill Team through 1000 points levels were fantastic). But even at these levels, lots of things were just like “huh? wha?”. Invisibility instantly dominates any game where it’s cast. Flyers are so hard to deal with at low points. I had one game where I tabled my opponent on my turn 2 with Genestealer Cult because I just rolled ALL 5’s and 6’s. And these are cultist-heavy cults, not even made good in any way.

      It was so easy to accidentally break the game that you could do it without even trying. I love the Eldar, because I think they look cool and I love their style of combat, but I was horribly overpowered even in a totally balanced list.

      Meanwhile, if someone took anything “classic” (like Tacticals, Captain, squad of Terminators, Assault Squad, Devastators, and a couple Rhinos), they were completely outclassed by even the basics of others. And my poor Tyranids. Suffering constantly because I like the idea of Tervigons vomiting up hoards of guys.

      No… the game had become too lopsided, even if you stuck completely to fluff. What I’ve seen HUGELY excites me. Since seeing what they’re doing for the Guard, I can’t wait to see what they do for my Nids!

      • Knight_of_Infinite_Resignation

        I agree with all you’ve said, yet your comments reveal the problem lies with the army books not the core 7th rules. Remember the same guys who wrote those army books will be writing the new ones for 8th…

        When GW resets a game and brings out a Ravening Hordes type set of lists, the game is balanced for a while, but imbalance creeps in as GW is addicted to using rules to sell models and is fundamentally not very good at balancing rules. Our only hope is that the new yearly updates and the community involvement tempers these issues somehow.

    • However, if you use gaming to make friends. If you haven’t been playing with the same dudes since 3rd edition. If you’re tired of having to build a structure around the game yourself because GW failed to do so. If you find that telling your opponent how they should play is bothersome. If you don’t want to feel out your community keeping a list of people you’d rather not play. Then 7th (and 6th to an extent) was not fun.
      A lot of this could have been mitigated by the community, particularly the online community, but people are people. Why would a group that “gets it” want to keep including new people? One of them could be power gamer! Better to just stick to your own group than take a chance on a newb. Now, I realize that not every community was like this, but a lot were. There’s a reason why you find very few people talking about the game who started in 6th or 7th. If the people who loved 7th had spent nearly the effort trying to sell the game as they did trying to shout down the “haters” (that sometimes were just newbs asking questions), then this shift might not ever have happened.

    • Man, I am right there with you, 100%, the last few rules releases have actually made me feel a little better, but fundamentally 8th mostly sounds like streamlining for tourneys sake, and I’m worried about the loss of the feel that made the game 40k

      • Knight_of_Infinite_Resignation

        I don’t mind a degree of simplification for 40K which is meant to be a fun mass battle game (like Warpath is meant to be, and I do wonder if 8th is perhaps not only AoSification but also an attempt to defend against Mantic’s alternative ruleset).

        Where it falls down though is for 30K, which NEEDS that grimdark feel and tactical rules that I don’t see 8th providing.

    • Carey_Mahoney

      Word!

    • Derptau

      I don’t know if I could say that the competitive scene is the perverted 40K more so than the rules themselves. When one of my buddy has the choice to run his 3 riptides (his favorite models in the game) then why wouldn’t he run a riptide wing? It would make no sense not too. There are just so many examples of this in the game at the moment that even if you’re not playing against a super competitive opponent it’s just frustrating.

      I’ve enjoyed the couple of AoS games I’ve played so far and 8th is really starting to feel like a cross between that and 2nd edition. I’m interested to see where this edition goes.

  • I just want to know how all this will pan out… viscous beakies anyone ?

  • Vachones

    Really well said and I agree.

    I will always have fond memories of 7th edition, but right now, even playing “casual” can be a chore. All the small things add up to slow the game down and it becomes more an exercise in list building. Did I take enough to play well at a competitive event? Did I tone it down enough to play a casual event? I love the psychic phase, but there are times when rolling for powers becomes tedious.

    40k in 7th, even at the start of 7th, is not an easy game to learn to play. I don’t even know where to start with a new player. New 40k or 8th so far looks to be so much easier to pick up and learn. But with everything changing, we will all have to learn together.

    Which brings me to my last point. 90% of 40k is “knowing stuff.” What your units do, what you can combo, what your opponents units can do and what they can combo. Now, its all going to be changed. Change is not easy, we have to rethink and relearn a bunch of stuff all over again. I think that is hard to accept for many players.

  • generalchaos34

    My dislike of 7th was slow growing, as a guard player I got really excited after Mont’ka but that slowly dwindled as I tried really really hard to make that stuff work. Yeah I could have played a War Convocation, I had the stuff, sure I could have copy pasted a SM superfriends grav list, but I wanted to win without cheese, to win simply because I made sound decisions and not because my units or formation had already stack the deck against my opponent (or in some cases, having all that was the ONLY chance I could win against their ridiculous stuff). So around January I gave up, rumors of 8th were swirling and I started AoS. I picked up some army stuff for super cheap and started playing….and it was great! The game was tight, there are very few “stupid” options and even less over powered ones. I could play the list I wanted and have fun. Now some are inherently not as good as others as new stuff developed and any high minded competitive list will still be a challenge but I still had a pretty good chance to win it. Plus the models are gorgeous and I got to paint something that wasnt gun metal and camo green. Now I see the best of AoS is going into 40k so I forsee myself being an extremely happy camper for this edition!

    • Verikus

      I have but one like to give.

      The idea that I can play a fluffy army and not be punished, or for simply taking walkers at all lol, is very exciting. If the games take less than 3 hours…woah, even better

    • Hendrik Booraem VI

      I hate to break it to you, but the fact that AoS isn’t broken isn’t because there’s nothing wrong with it. It’s because it’s only been out for 2 years and isn’t played competitively by thousands of people.

      AOS40K will reveal the flaws in the system soon enough.

      If it doesn’t, I will be happy to come back and admit that I was wrong, and 8th edition is great and I’m having lots of fun.

      • Muninwing

        there were some huge problems at debut with AoS. GHB fixed some, but not all. it’s a game like any other, and while the live ruleset and reassessment and FAQ-fixing is a good idea, that’s something that GW refused to do with other games.

        there is no reason why 40k 7th couldn’t have used the “live ruleset” model to keep the game updated. even so far as to purging the points-model used and replacing it with a better-evaluated algorithm.

        they could have. they didn’t. because it’s too hard, takes too much, and doesn’t yield profit on the short term. i would argue that keeping a game well-balanced brings more players in and therefore sells more, as well as contributes to its reputation as a quality product, but i’ve been trying to make that case for most of the last decade and GW has disagree with me up until now.

        that’s perhaps my biggest fear with these changes. that they are being made in order to facilitate a new style that GW will drop the ball at in a matter of a year.

  • ZeeLobby

    Pretty much this. Our group only goes to 2 or 3 events a year. But we play every week. Will be nice to just show up with lists and have fun games again.

  • Agent OfBolas

    I

    Can’t

    Wait

    🙂

    • euansmith

      And yet…

      … you must.

      • Agent OfBolas

        oh you! 😉

  • I’m still not there yet, and TBH it may take me years to get there. I play AoS and it’s fine, but you’re right it badly lacks customization and a unique personal feel for armies. I love 40k as a game, and thenew game just doesn’t sound like 40k to me. Templates and scatter die, deep striking to get rear armor on opposing vehicles, dreadnoughts tearing through a wall of men unable to even glance them, random charts of abilities, rewards from the chaos gods, that’s 40k to me. The new game just doesn’t scratch that itch from what I’ve seen. I’m just gonna paint my minis and play shadow wars, maybe when enough time has passed I’ll be able to settle for this new and mediocre replacement.

    I need to get my 30k stuff painted so I can enjoy what’s left of 7th

    • kloosterboer

      We’ll be here when you’re ready.

      • One thing I’m not gonna do is sell my armies like those fools, I mean kind fellows that allowed me to quickly amass a substantial AoS army cheaply after End Times haha

    • Carey_Mahoney

      Exactly!!

    • Kazzigum

      Oh, I don’t know, there might still be rewards/punishments for chaos. At least I hope so.

    • Muninwing

      “but you’re right it badly lacks customization and a unique personal feel for armies.”

      this.

      this is, also, the reason i don’t play Warmachine.

      meaning that in yet another way, GW would rather try to be more like PP than to recognize its own assets and build on them.

      did they just hire someone in upper management who used to work for PP and is pressing for some big changes? or are they just really panicking?

  • Daniel R Weber

    I would argue ‘incredibly’ balanced pretty hard, but it’s pretty cinematic and fun. I always thought it would fit better into 40k than WHFB, seems my thinking was borne out. I haven’t been playing 7e much, mainly because of all the creep and books needed and the poster boys and elves seemingly the only factions GW cared about for the entire edition. I’m VERY interested in everything I’ve seen so far. Want to see and play the final product before I decide, but I haven’t been excited/interested in 40k for a good long time (and have been playing since 1e, mind) other than HH, so this is a Good Thing.

    Also, it’s not just at tournaments. My local 40k non-tournament meta might as well be tournament standard for how hard the players work to suck the fun out of the game with their lists. So, yeah, it needs a change for everyone.

    • Muninwing

      be that as it may, i”m still left hungry for ranks and flanks… AoS just doesn’t fill the void for me. but neither does KoW.

      i think i would have accepted AoS far more had they either announced that they were archiving WHF for later but devoting time to a new game… or if they didn’t pretend that the two really had anything to do with each other… or even if they did, they established a more complex or interesting relationship rather than a more shallow one between the two.

      my current wish for a lost opportunity here is that AoS should have been revealed at some point to be the WHF etc’s afterlife… that all the armies and nations and races all went here after the ET… and that it is reflective of the balances and imbalances of the myriad mortal realms that are all connected by the WInds of Magic and the Realms of Chaos. that what happens in the larger-than-life Afterworld affects everything. then, all the undefined and ridiculously vague elements of the setting actually make sense. then, too, they could state that they were focusing on this game for awhile, but that they’d go back to another undestroyed world’s struggles for a remake of WHF eventually… and each successive new edition of WHF would be the struggles of a new planet or new world that was in turn reflected in AoS.

      • Daniel R Weber

        Might I suggest you look at Runewars. It’s just starting out but I’m like you with kow not scratching my rnf itch right. I find so far runewars is a happy balance between three blandness of kow and the rules heavier 7e.

  • Hendrik Booraem VI

    Walkers will still suck. Dreadnoughts won’t be able to hold their own against a boyz mob of 30 slugga boyz. Heavy 3 is not impressive, heavy 6 isn’t either – heavy bolters are not becoming the new “it” weapon. Grav will still be king unless they toned down its ridiculousness. Flyers will probably be the new unstoppable, but walkers will still suck.

    They lied to you. They didn’t know the difference between “rapid fire” and “twin-linked” in their own promotional literature. The “faction previews” are literally just marketing literature. Why do you think that this one edition will solve all your problems?

    You can fix all of the problems with WH40K yourself. Don’t be a dick, but if you want to play in tournaments, accept that the style of the game is totally different. Bam – problem solved.

    • Kazzigum

      I accept tournament play fine. Doesn’t change the fact that 7th edition is broken.

    • COsteve

      Maybe calm down and wait for more information?

  • John Felger

    I left Games Workshop behind three and a half years ago for better games and haven’t regretted it yet. I heard another edition was coming out and was like, “snort.”

    • JJ

      Then why post here bout the new edition?

      • Commissar Molotov

        Why not?

    • Francesco Abagnale

      I feel you man. Beyond the Gates of Antares is such a great game for instance! so much better than any version of 40k that has ever existed, and it’s in it’s V1! but yeah rick priestley pretty much made 40k and has learnt from it. 8th won’t bring me back to 40k especially if it is like AOS..
      AOS is clearly not strategic or tactical, there is literally no progression curve, it’s just pay2win.. GW makes great models, but that’s all, nothing is gonna change imo

      • Muninwing

        the background seems just a little too generic scifi to me…

        ideally i’d love to see BtGoA in the 40k setting. maybe that would be a good playable compromise

    • Kazzigum

      Eh, I’m addicted. And I like the background.

  • Donald Lindsey

    This article is missing the apology to all of the people who have been on board since day 1 and had to listen to the incessant nay-saying from the author and others like him until they figured it out.

  • memitchell

    The Genestealer Codex and army were the first serious 40K purchases I made since 4th Edition. If you haven’t introduced a new (old) player to 40K lately, is is absurdly difficult. CAD, free form, ITC, formations, whatever a Decurion is. Psychic cards, universal rules that require a second book that says things like, “Tough as Nails grants units Hard to Kill.” Not quite sure my army is legal, and having absolutely no way of knowing if my opponent’s army is legal, and his rules interpretations are real. And, I am NOT exaggerating. I got around to playing ONE 40K game, and ONE Kill team game. And, now, the codex for which I waited 19 years will be obsolete after 6 months (OK, I added that because it’s humorously ironic).

  • Muninwing

    “So then I thought, perhaps it’s because this edition, despite all my warnings a couple years back and the denials that GW would never do such a thing, is basically an adapted version of Age of Sigmar (AOS). And make no mistake, this new edition of 40k will be basically an AOS 2.0.”

    this is… not quite right.

    see, my issue with change is never about whether things should change in general — change is a constant, and adaptability is the key to life. no… it’s looking at why the changes are happening, and whether those reasons are valid, or if they imply something else.

    my biggest issue with all of the changes — from AoS to what we’ve seen of 40k 8th — is that they point toward a fundamentally different system with fundamentally different concepts underpinning them.

    almost as if we are seeing the end of Games Workshop games, and the beginning of some other company with some other games who are happening to use some of the same background.

    some changes i appreciate.
    some changes seem to be hyped up “no this is easier!” lateral moves that actually change nothing.
    some changes seem to be attempts to streamline or outright gut parts of the game — and with certain parts (psychic phase) that may be well-deserved, but the results look very little like the 40k i started playing.

    my running comment is that it seems like we have a completely new group of designers who have really no understanding of what they have inherited. now they are being given free reign to do their own thing, and we are seeing the adaptation of someone’s 2nd rate D&D setting or bad scifi novel being substituted into the places where product and ideas of quality and depth have been for decades.

    8th is really going to be a fundamentally different game. maybe it’s time for that? but i still have not found my replacement for WHF, since how AoS plays really has nothing to do with why i liked WHF, but KoW doesn’t get it right either. and that makes me nervous that 40k will be so intrinsically different that it just won’t feel worth it to play.