10 Big Surprises in Warhammer Age of Sigmar Book



The Tome worthy of Sigmar is finally here! Checkout these Top Ten “Shockers” that we may have missed about what’s happening in the new Age of Sigmar!

1) True Homies –  Tyrion can see though his brother Teclis’ eyes. They wonder the realm of Hysh looking for any sign of other Aelfkind, but as of yet have found none (besides Malerion and his mother, who is ‘changed’).

2) They’ll be Back – When a Stormcast dies, he returns to Sigmar’s Realm as a flash of energy, ready to be reforged once gain. However they slowly lose a piece of themselves each time.

3) The New Gods – Tyrion, Teclis and Malerion Two of these Aelfkind are newly born gods, which two is anyone’s guess at this point but my money is on Tyrion and Malerion.

4) Blinded by the Light – Sigmar persuaded Teclis and Malerion to join forces and provide a barrier that surrounded the heavens and perplexed even the great Tzeentch himself. Under the cover of these clouds, the Stormcasts were created.

5) Summon Daemons – In battles fought using the Time of War campaign, Chaos Lords have a very good chance of summoning in units of Daemons every turn!

6) Nagash Risen – Nagash rises again (after being dispatched by Archaon) and with him all of the restless dead across the mortal realms. They bay to his commands, and now the walking dead battle side by side with the God King’s forces.

7) Lightning Bolts – The Dwarven God Grungni created the means by which Sigmar could teleport his forces to the realms. The rest was up to them once they arrived, as the only way they would return to Azyrheim was via a realm gate or by their demise.

8) Ghal Maraz – The fabled hammer, lost by Sigmar has been spotted in the realm of Chamon guarded by Tzeentch’s forces.

9) SPIES! –  The Skaven have spies stealthy hiding in Sigmar’s court, and they know where Ghal Maraz is now too.

10) The Betrayer. It was Nagash who was the great betrayer. He let down Sigmar in the final battle against Chaos in the Allpoints war – only to be shived in the back by the Skaven who had penetrated his realm of Shyish. Thus beginning the War of Bones.



~These Age of Sigmar campaign books are really cool. It’s like reading the original Realms of Chaos books decades ago – we are seeing wholesale worldbuilding again coming from Nottingham.

  • false-emperor

    It has pages of fluff, SURPRISE!
    (and the same rules that are online for free, surprise?)

    • Matt

      But it’s the BEST THING EVER!!11

      I wonder how much GW paid for all of this hype cluttering the front page every day.

      • Herod

        They are struggling so hard create hype that it is embarrassing.

        • Matt

          Gotta help GW polish this turd somehow…

          • Marky

            Freeze that ties and shine it up nice… Or just roll it in glitter.

  • John Felger

    Personally, I feel they took the cartoon feel of their fluff up a couple of thousand notches in AOS. That says a great deal given they were pure melodrama before AOS.

    • Vorropohaiah

      now you mention it, this would make a great cartoon, in the style of He-man or something like that. the AAAAGGGEEEEEEE of Sigmarrrr!!!

      • wibbling

        Good. we’re all far too serious.

        • Ira Clements

          Thundaar the Barbarian!
          Which I own…. and watch. At 43.

          • Ira Clements

            Honestly all this comparing AoS to Saturday morning cartoons makes me want it more. Nothing was sweeter in life than watching Saturday morning cartoons, eating my Grandmas waffles and then playing D&D in the afternoon with my friends. Around the same time I was taking my first steps into the miniature painting hobby with Poly S paints and Grenadier and Ral Partha minis.

          • Jonathan B.

            Nothing at all wrong with that. I have the Dungeons & Dragons cartoon from the 1980s and I’m 42.

          • Always a good time to go back and watch that. I still play with BECMI rules myself from time to time. Anyway, the “basic” and “cartoony” aspects of this game are kinda part of its charm. It’s fun, simple and gives me a chance to the play fast(er) games my schedule demands at 40. I wish I could have time to paint 100’s of models and have 3 hours for a game, but as it is (with wife, bills, kids,etc) I don’t. This game allows for fantasy skirmishes and I love it

          • Joe Sleboda

            44 here, and own those and He-man as well.

            I’ve given in. Saturday morning cartoon Warhammer…and loving it.

      • Commissar Molotov

        Snarf, snarf.

      • zemlod
  • Erik Setzer

    If Teclis is helping Maleki-, Malerion, then why would Tyrion be a god?

    Chaos just obliterated these guys’ planet, and now not only are the Superfriends still alive (making all of that “sacrifice” in End Times pointless), but are somehow powerful enough to go toe-to-toe with gods, who gained a lot of power by devouring the world they failed to protect?

    The “they’ll be back” thing with the Stormcast Eternals makes me dislike them more. From their cheesy names for everything to their cheesy background. They come down in lightning drop pods? They “lose a bit of themselves every time they reform” even though there’s almost certainly nothing left in there to begin with?

    All of this is hard enough to make any sense with, but it makes a lot less sense if they aren’t claiming the Warhammer world never existed and the End Times didn’t happen. I just can’t suspend my disbelief when I see a world completely wiped out, heroes and villains dying to up the stakes, Chaos triumphant, and then suddenly the heroes are back as gods who are more powerful than the gods who destroyed the world they failed to save, at least one villain is back even though his story is complete (so a new villain would make more sense), all these old races got remade but for some reason chose to take on new names…

    They really need their own version of Lucy Wilson or something. Or at least to stop letting interns (or their kids) write the fluff. That’s the kind of stuff I would have written when I was 12 (and did). Not what I expect from a major game company.

    I hope they don’t mess up 40K the same way.

    • Telok

      it’s not true that nothing is left after their transformation in Eternals, Sigmar leaves part of their memories to give them motivation when they are sent to battle, to rise their desire of vengeance and retribution

      • izmerul

        how lame

    • Malisteen

      I agree, in part. While I actually like the overall tone of the new fluff and setting, and the fluff for the eternals, the excuse for bussing slaanesh makes no sense at all. ‘When they’ve gorged on souls’ is exactly when chaos gods are at their most powerful, not their most vulnerable, and the warhammer world was just one world of countless many, even the End Times implies as much, which means consuming all the souls of that world shouldn’t have been too much for a chaos god to handle.

      That a couple of the recently-defeated incarnates should suddenly be strong enough to dethrone slaanesh absolutely doesn’t make sense at all. It would have been far better if his disappearance were allowed to be a mystery, like he just went absent, and it’s left unclear if its part of the a plot by Slaanesh hirself, or something the incarnates did, or the other chaos gods. Then slaanesh players could be as invested as the god’s in-narrative servants in finding their lost god, instead of already knowing the (stupid, anticlimactic) answer, and the designers would have time to think up something better than this.

      I also agree that way too old faces are taking up all the important real estate. Maybe one or two survivors – Sigmar of course, Nagash maybe, the Glotkin could still be around since they got a fancy model, but for all of the incarnates to still be here? For Archaon instead of a new champion to be leading the forces of chaos? It completely undercuts both the sacrifices and significance of the End Times. Worse, it significantly undermines the new AoS setting, since all of the important, formative, character defining moments of all of the most important movers and shakers in the setting all happened in the old world. So if you want to know or care about any of these characters, then it’s the old warhammer fluff and the old warhammer world that you have to look to, not anything from Age of Sigmar.

      It is a major flaw, imo.

      • Drew

        I like reading about the survivors (though I would have preferred for more of them to be gone and gone), but I hadn’t considered your point about new players needing the Old World now to understand who these people are…that’s an interesting angle, and one of some concern, unless they’re going to push the story forward and away from the echoes of the Old World.

        • Xodis

          I don’t think the old stories are needed, but I do think knowing them enhances the experience. I never read any WHFB fluff or even played it before AoS, but I dont feel as if I am missing anything either by NOT knowing.
          I will agree that less classic characters would probably be better, but for us that are new to the game, everyone is a new character.

          • Muninwing

            see, i want to know about all the stuff that has recently happened.

            or to look at a map.

            or to have an idea what the various new settlements look like.

            i’m all for fluff with a theme and a feel and a sense of being greater, but the lack of really much of anything makes it feel poorly thought through and only halfway completed. that is to say, badly executed. and with a lot of telling us that we should find it epic without spending the effort to show us why we should feel how epic these struggles and times truly are.

      • Stan

        The major flaw was destroying the Old World in its entirety and not basing AoS in the apocalyptic aftermath of the End Times.
        Then they could have had the remnants of the societies of the Old World struggling to survive on a planet that was engulfed by the Realms of Chaos.
        The continuation of concept and characters would be more logical and the 30 years of books, fluff, and IP wouldn’t have been indiscriminately thrown away.

      • Retconned Legion

        Personally I wouldn’t have made Tyrion or Teclis gods. Their story, as it was related to Aenarion and the rift between the elves, was done in the End Times. Nagash and Sigmar, that’s decent enough, two gods, with history, they fit. Archeon I would’ve had the gods kill, stop him from getting ideas above his station.
        But this is an evolving setting, so maybe we will see Slaanesh’s revenge. Kidnapping a chaos god strikes me as a monumentally bad idea.

      • Knight_of_Infinite_Resignation

        it is very silly, and bodes poorly for 40K.

        This fluff seems to drive a wedge between fantasy and 40K which needn’t have been there, and wasn’t there in WHFB.

        • Muninwing

          more importantly, the fluff is silly.

          it’s warmachine bad, where the same ten people are everywhere fighting all the skirmishes that never actually turn into wars because they are really just some dude’s D&D run…

          WHF had history like a world does, with ages of mystery being uncovered (and known to select few), modern events, established allegiances, oddities from the past, and moreover reasons for all of it.

          this is just kludge-justifications for too much at once. without actual plot or story.

          it’s sloppy, or lazy,or both.

          it violates one of the primary imaginitive fiction writing rules — if you need to describe too much of the mechanics of the situation immediately, you’ve already done it wrong.

        • Muninwing

          imagine, for a second, that the release had gone something like this:

          1. fiction piece from the point of view of someone who had become a Stormcast, about rising to battle and being redeemed, filling in many of the blanks at the end of the End Times books.

          2. starter set announced with stormcast vs khorne (now that people know wtf a stormcast is), with a steady slow stream of leaks about what the game will be… including an announcement that WHF9 will not be a thing (the sooner your diehards get their anger out, the better)

          3. fiction piece from the point of view of a Nurgle warrior, seeing the rise and primacy of Khorne… and the capture and blunting of Slaanesh (but with care to note that the daemons are still around, setting the stage for an all-chaos campaign or game or the like for later), ending with the resolution to be patient (for eventually everything rots away). release the new starter a week later.

          4. hardcover book like an atlas — detailing how the worlds interact, who is where, what is happening, why players should care, and how their games make sense in the new format… with a section at the end with rules for campaigns, and a teaser at the end announcing a forthcoming larger campaign…

          5. AFTER all allegiances and factions are detailed, release of warscrolls for each old model, so that players can get a feel for how it will all come together, and can accurately feel out how their army will play and fit into the greater puzzle, instead of attempting to force the old system to make sense with the new rules

          6. release of three new starter sets and a small campaign for them, so that they (and the two already-released) were completely up-to-date… maybe focus on Nurgle, Humans, and whatever the Orcs become. take care to fit it into the atlas. also unify the online element of the game — including the creation of an online record-system for campaigns (maybe a once-a-year $10 subscription that you can use to make army lists, upload pics of your units, share lists with other registered users in preparation for games, buy from the webstore, access your datascrolls/warscrolls/etc, and set up long-term campaign structures). debut it with the 5-army campaign, but have the ability for the other factions to use it as well.

          7. fluff piece from the point of view of the former generals of Slaanesh, competing with each other and the skaven and others for supremacy… including some hints at shamylanesque twists.

          8. another 3-faction release, with starter sets for each, new generals, and a campaign focused around the three. maybe the old-world lizardmen and undead, as well as tzeentch. create a campaign around them in order to drum up interest.

          9. rules expansion: how to use more complicated magic

          10. fluff piece from the point of view of a human in the new world-construct, rising through the ranks and pondering the past as well as the future, and some seeds of chaos beginning to take root.

          11. another major release: Slaanesh, dwarves, skaven, and Elves, with a campaign that starts laying out everything people want to know about slaanesh

          12. rules for integrating old Brettonians into humans, giving elves specific flavor, and reincorporating Beasts into chaos. also, debut of a chess-style ranking system for players to use their accounts to collect acheivements and ranks and set up a system that would translate into tournaments. reinstitute prize support if it goes well. have the standings of the various factions influence (a) faq-balancing of warscrolls, (b) benefits/perks in the next campaign, (c) elevation of certain generalities to named heroes, including the ability for campaign/tournament winners once a year to create new named characters for inclusion into the fluff and perhaps the game.

          13. major campaign: The Return of Slaanesh, with plot and historical/current battles, and using the above-mentioned tracking system for determining the next phase of the world-building

          14. released apocalypse-style rules for larger battles, including the use of larger flying beasts and war-constructs.

          15. small-scale skirmish rules for the creation of mordheim-style warbands for use in a specific setting, including specs for treasure-carrying, possessions, equipment, and stealth

          16. new expansion: no new armies, but a new world/realm/area to play in. a fragment from the past that somehow broke through time, with potential treasures. set up a campaign that would require smaller skirmish games, stealth, and trickery (perhaps using space hulk blip rules) in order to raid the wealth of the new plane… individual maps and mods would come out every week for a couple months to play different scenarios. it would also require standard play, and allow larger play. if successful, make it a once-a-year big release and add warscrolls specific to the new arena (next year could be sea combat, or flying, or jungle, etc etc.

          if these were once-a-month releases, with the occasional step aside for 40k, you’d have a completely new game, less old player loss, reasons for new models, events that would get players active, reestablishment of tournaments and the competitive end, a feel for the new world, and a fanbase that would feel actively involved in their hobby. in a year and a half or so, it would become as established as the old WHF was, and begin to feel as complete by way of feeling like it is developing and living instead of just existing.

          instead, many of us feel betrayed by the radical shift and the “jk-lol oops” of there being no WHF9.

          • Knight_of_Infinite_Resignation

            that would indeed be much better, you should be working for GW!

    • Cergorach

      It’s not ‘just’ it’s been a LONG time since End Times. Heroes were defeated by four Chaos gods and a couple of factions. The Chaos gods got lucky and ‘destroyed’ the Old World, but couldn’t be bothered to keep working together, everyone started stabbing everyone in the back, happens with CE guys…

      You don’t like it, fine, move on.

      I have not read all the End Times fluff yet, but got the general lines of it, the same is true for AoS fluff. I’ll get to it eventually, but I currently have better novels to read instead of the dime store novels BL mostly publishes. Don’t get me wrong, I sometimes love to read the junk novels, but often the BL material is a pain to read (like the Horus Heresy novels).

  • Horus Lupercal

    So i dont get it…are there Elves living in Azyrheim or are they all lost (eaten by Slaanesh)

    • Drew

      As near as we can tell from what they’ve given us, there are some (not many) Elves living in Azyrheim; Tyrion, Teclis, Morathi, and Malerion/Malekith have all survived, but they are searching for any signs of other survivors of their race. No such luck yet, except for Alarielle, who is (mostly) alive and well as a life goddess in Ghyran. She seems more like Ariel of old than like Alarielle, however, which makes sense based on what happened in the End Times story.

  • TweetleBeetle

    It isn’t a rulebook/BRB. It absolutely isn’t required for play, and all the warscrolls and scenarios are available for download anyway. The fluff and gallery bits are nice, and I’m glad I bought it, but it most certainly isn’t a “264 page rulebook.”

    Expect we’ll receive books like these every so often, while actual game play rules will remain free to download, and/or alongside model kits. It’s like PP’s source books, which aren’t required for play, but are fun to have.

    • Chris D’Andrea

      Please post a official link to the Scenarios and Warscroll Battalions. Those items are only available to date in that book. But yeah I am not buying a $75 book for 4 battalions and 6 (or 8?) scenarios.

      • Jonathan N Hord

        But neither of those is *required* to play the game. See this book as more of a campaign book. Nothing in a campaign book is *required* but it can add fun elements to forge your forces like in the fluff. The scenarios and Battalions are made to reflect the story of the realmgate wars. You are free to play AoS games without those. I haven’t enjoyed a book like this since the Eldar Iyanden Supplement. Both of which added little to the actual gameplay but were fantastic stories.

      • Xodis

        Youre not paying $75 for 4 battalions and 6/8 scenarios. You would be paying $75 for 264 pages of information about a specific campaign that includes fluff, rules, and art.
        Is it steep? Very much so.
        Is it required? Only if you choose to play that campaign /narrative.
        Will they eventually release those battalions and scenarios for free? It COULD happen, but then again it probably wont.

    • Retconned Legion

      I think it’s GWS best book since End Times: Nagash. Of course, that series rapidly went downhill…

  • sniperjack

    Fluff is, I dont know, what to say.
    Maybe i’m to old for this.
    Lets all say it: I’m to old for this s**t.

    • wibbling

      The reading would do you good though.

      • Knight_of_Infinite_Resignation

        he’d have to find his varifocals first, and can’t remember where they are (clue, they are on his forehead).

        That said, I am also too old for this. A little bit of me died with WHFB.

    • Matt

      The fluff would be cartoonishly fun if there were some decent rules to go with it.

    • Jonathan B.

      Is this some form of haiku? Here’s mine:
      The Age of Sigmar,
      A new game, fresh beginning;
      Fan base power whines.

      • Knight_of_Infinite_Resignation

        Age of Sigmar comes,
        As a last bright blossom grows,
        On a dying tree.

      • Michael Gerardi

        Age of Sigmar’s here.
        WHFB customer?
        Sucks for you, player.

    • Stan

      After a certain point in a healthy, self sustaining society, you are supposed to have your own children and share interests like this game with them.
      They would perhaps like the fluff and share their enthusiasm with you.

    • izmerul

      yup, I see no other explanation. I’m too old for this too …

  • Fungrim

    Oh look a mention of Dwarfs!… *woosh!*…
    Nice while it lasted..

  • Benderisgreat

    “they bay to his commands”

    So he stands in front of a horde of his skeletal minions and orders them to make…. hound dog noises?

    “Bay, damn you! BAY!”

    Skeletons look at each other, perplexed, then shrug.


    • dinodoc

      Maybe they explode Michael Bay style at his command?

      • Benderisgreat

        With lots of gratuitous smoke effects and camera jiggle.

      • Knight_of_Infinite_Resignation

        perhaps they put their miniature collections on a well known internet sale website?

        • Muninwing

          or just burned them?

  • Tlhswallow RGN

    You forgot That Slaanesh is missing…

  • Secundum


  • kaptinscuzgob

    copypasting that article again huh?

  • Foehammer7977

    What I don’t get about everyone’s hate is how is this ANY different from how Privateer Press has been doing business for years. They have been selling fairly expensive books ($50 for a hardback I think) that really contain nothing but fluff. They have rules for new units, but those rules are available on cards that come with the units, making the book completely optional. People still manage to buy and enjoy them.
    This approach actually seems very much like PP, where the books provide new units, but are more akin to themed advances in the world’s storyline. In this book they battle in the realm of fire and a nurgle invasion of the realm of life. The next may be the story of the dwarves fighting in the realm of Metal against Tzeentch. Seems to provide a much more dynamic and compelling world than the old one, but only time will tell.
    My biggest disappointment is the slow pace of miniature releases. I would have expected GW to push at least 1 new box for each of the new factions right out the gate, as the miniatures have always been GW’s selling point, not their game quality. Show me these “Fyreslayers riding strange magma beasts” and might be sold. I’ve been waiting for dwarves to have more than a gunline for over 10 years. But instead we see a whole week of releases dedicated to a guy with a lamp and a pet bird-lion-dog.

    • John Felger

      The difference is a tight, working rules set, community support, a good relationship with their customers, and the fact that no matter how many models they have released you can still play the game with the same original models you bought and have a decent chance. I’m just as competitive today as I was six years ago and I just dabble in a new model here and there. What GW has done is NOTHING like how Privateer is setup. It always comes back to the game itself. Is it any good.

    • Listen to a single episode of their podcasts and you’ll see that the difference between Privateer Press and GW is as day and night. They interact with their community, take feedback, involve them in the process of evolving the game, aren’t hiding information from them til they open preorders…

      And that is just the stuff I noticed off the bat, not even being a player of Warmachine or Hordes or anything else that PP does.

      • Foehammer7977

        Oh I didn’t state that from a 10,000 foot level that PP and GW don’t operate completely differently. They do. I was stating that, at a micro level, the concept of an expensive fluff book with redundant rules isn’t a completely new concept for the industry, and that is what the many of the complaints are about.

        Also, comparing the game quality of Warmachine, which has developed over years and years, with a GW game that is less than a month old isn’t exactly comparing apples to apples. Especially as WM is a game very much centered around competitive play at its core, while AoS obviously isn’t.

        • EndreFodstad

          Oh, I don’t know, PP has released quite a few very “narrative” products and articles over the years. While the game certainly has a very solid competitive scene, that doesn’t really take away anything from the more fluff-centred players.

          • Muninwing

            i have issues with this statement.

            funny enough, i have the same issue with GW products focusing on named characters, which they have been doing more and more over the years…

            if the entire modern history of your nation deals with the same five people fighting the same twenty people from four other nations, your fluff (and potentially your game) is just bad.

            it works in Malifaux, because the game is the size of a city. even then, they seem to have as many important people as the entirety of the Iron Kingdoms.

            and everyone else is a mook. a meat shield. a nobody. you cannot design your own warcaster, you cannot modify your mechs, you cannot adapt to the meta on a model-sized basis (you have to take different mechs, or beasts, or whatever). and you must have one of the most famous people in your nation in your warband.

            Rommel wasn’t present for every axis win in northern Africa. Patton didn’t lead the vanguard of the Battle of the Bulge. so why are the only battles in the IK the ones personally led by these few?

            it makes less sense in 40k… given that a person might spend their entire life crossing the galaxy once, since Warp-travel is as unreliable as it is short (on a galaxy scale). why should Belial be everywhere at once? and why should Telion, or Pask, be involved in every battle their army is on, across mind-shattering distances?

          • EndreFodstad

            While I certainly agree the expansion books for Wm/H don’t have sterling fluff (neither does a lot of other miniature game universes, it has to be said) you’re giving the IK world as a whole a raw deal here. There is a lot more going on than four warcasters and a king/empress/disembodied dragon doing all the work. Especially when you are commenting on a post that spesifically mentions the non-expansion book narrative gaming material.

            Modifying your characters isn’t the whole of immersion. It is a mode badly suited to tabletop wargames anyway, as GW has been demonstrating these last thirty years. That, in my mind at least, is for RPGs.

          • Muninwing

            firstoff, by “modifying your characters” i mean “do i want a sword or an axe… a horse or a relic?” maybe “do i want a hero who uses strength or one who uses skill?”

            if that’s your RPG experience, i hate to tell you that you’re doing it wrong, but…

            each of the 5 or so main named characters in each army is different and unique, but they only ever seem to interact with each other, and there are no rising stars to replace them when they die… except in a wargame that involves giant machines and guns and magic they also never seem to die.

            i personally think that one of the choices that spelled doom for WHF was the license to put named characters in any list. and WM/H is so dependent on their small list of named characters with set tricks and non-adaptable playstyle, so why would i want to follow in its mediocre example for a game that used to have so much potential to fill in the blanks in between centuries worth of stories?

          • EndreFodstad

            Enjoy your rpg strawman.

            My impression of your second point is that you haven’t really read much IK fluff.

            What spelled doom for whfb was GWs inability to create a fantasy wargame with broad appeal in the modern marketplace. They kept losing players for a large variety of reasons, and while unable (as anybody are) to satisfy everybody, they were equally unable to interest enough new people. It doesn’t look as if the new setting and ruleset will change that.

          • Muninwing

            not sure you know what a strawman is…

            i’ll admit that i haven’t read IK stuff since around their 2nd edition, when the sparseness and triteness of it all was just not enough for me to keep playing a game that was all messed up scale-wise.

            i know it shouldn’t bother me, but it does. five people cannot be in every battle in their country. the lack of generic casters as opposed to named characters makes for the kind of heroic superhero-ness that requires plot armor and tons of deus ex machina to keep them going. i have the same issue in GW games, and will argue that the the beginning of the end for WHF was allowing named characters in common armies.

            i will also say that the ‘broad appeal” is a curious concept. nobody involved in what someone else called “the dark age of gaming” would have ever predicted the mainstreaming of D&D or the success of WoW… and if you look at the whole market, yes, GW has not made a real dent. but they’ve come closer than PP, Mantic, Wyrd… they are still by a ridiculous margin, the bestselling miniatures game company in the market. 40k itself outsells most of their competition combined. but fantasy has been falling out of popularity for years, and it has not had the steady trickle in of the old market, for various reasons. their issues, however, have mostly been external economics (the huge international economic crisis that people love to forget about) or significant internal ones for nearly a decade.

            many people have pet theories about why GW has had issues, particularly with WHF. it’s not too hard to add on or choose a camp. personally, i don’t think most of the pet theories are correct, even GW’s own.

            they cite cost of entry, they cite difficult rules, they cite stagnant oldschool players, and they cite lack of new blood.

            cost of entry is a manufactured issue after 8th promoted larger blocks of entry. that could have been handled in 9th by
            -giving incentives for more units, a la support scores or flanking bonus
            -allowing for a system that encouraged unit spacers and in-unit dioramas to help fill out the footprint
            -creating an AoS-style (or, you know, Mordheim-style) skirmish game to fill that niche, and have it as the starter to get people interested in the larger game… which was the rumor they allowed to spread

            complex rules were not a problem at all — eroding the spirit of those rules with things like random charge length and overpowered/unbalanced individual armies due to no cohesive leadership… that was the main problem. but far be it for a CEO to promote their own failing, and instead latch on to fixing things that are less of a problem

            stagnant oldschool players are only an issue if the new edition fails to capture interest. that’s where GW has been failing since about 2007. the erosion of their two main games by players who are not WAAC or tournament players, who invest in an army or two only to have them gutted by bad rules or abrupt and arbitrary changes in direction, that causes people to stop buying and stop playing. if people are still playing, they can justify adding to their army. it’s a collector’s hobby, after all.

            additionally, GW-sponsored tournaments used to be the law of the land. once their codex/armybook rules stopped even pretending to be balanced, that was when they discontinued prize support and tournaments slowed down. they cut to save money short-term, but strangled themselves long-term, just as the “cut the overhead” plan always does. and again, it coincides with a certain CEO taking over… a buffoon whose financial reports showed that the field where he grows his fvcks hath lain barren for many a fortnight.

            the only issue that they are potentially dealing with is the new blood. their sloppy and incomplete AoS release is still salvageable, if they admit that they’ve been phoning it in for years and decide to put on their adult pants. but its simplicity will be a novelty for the potential younger players, which will probably run like the LotR stuff did and peter out. if they fix it, add to it, and make it a draw, they could smash-and-grab part of the market for long enough to put out a better-done second edition that would grow and change.

            i posted something in the forums “i’ve realized my problem with AoS” that is rather long… but i do a better job of detailing my real issues with the game there.

        • Heritor

          Now, what these players will not tell you is Warmachines is a game completely dominated by its meta. So, while they are talking about how PP listens to feedback and such they are not telling you that the game is very linear. Warmachines doesn’t have fluff lists because they don’t work and the game is “you play this faction, so you play this list. no deviation.”.

          It is great for tourney players and their community is getting toxic.

    • izmerul

      if we liked it we’d be playing privateer press…

      and frankly when I see the look of the models PP comes up with they don’t make me want to even look at the fluff

    • Cannibalbob

      I don’t purchase the Privateer Press books anymore for the reasons that you mention. The rules are available on the cards, so the only real selling point for the books is the fluff, rules for factions that you do not intend to purchase, and the theme lists.

      Most theme lists are terrible, and you can photocopy the ones that are good. You can also get all the rules that you want in the poorly built digital app that they make. As the books release they put all the rules into the Warroom app, so you don’t need the books for the rules.

      The main selling point of the books is the fluff, which is fine. But while I still enjoy the game, and have played for almost 10 years, I just don’t care one bit about their fluff anymore It never really does evolve, even though it is meant to do so. Nothing of any real meaning happens to any of the characters since they have massive plot armor. That might be ok if the stories were very well written and interesting, but I find the writing fairly mediocre and the plots tend to be pretty simplistic.

      Wyrd has the same strategy as Privateer Press with book releases that are filled with fluff and models, but I have found their fluff to be much better written and very interesting so I happily buy those books.

      • EndreFodstad

        When Malifaux first book ended in a massive Deus Ex Machinae I sort of lost interest. Has the fluff gotten better after that?

        • Cannibalbob

          From the 10,000 foot view the fluff is not overly different from Privateer Press stuff. The various masters all seem to have some sort of plot armor and while meaningful things do happen to them I don’t expect that Wyrd will want to do anything overly drastic such as kill any of them.

          However, I think that it works better in Malifaux to have the characters follow a sort of comic-book style since the game is not about generals, armies, and nation-wide conflicts. Malifaux is about individual people in a strange alternate world who are following personal agendas.

          I find that the stories work better because they are about individuals such as notorious serial killers, detectives of various bureaus, lawmen, outlaws, demons stalking ordinary people, etc. Even the stories about the few overt Tyrant characters, who are absurdly powerful creatures attempting to attain godhood, involve very specific individual agendas and not huge clashes of forces.

          In addition, I find that the writers tend to be more original in how they frame the stories and tell them. They do a much better job of building the world and evoking the terrifying alien horror that lies creeping around any given corner of Malifaux. Nobody is safe there and they capture that well.

          They also tell many of their stories from non-master points of view. A lot of stories are told from more mundane people and their run-ins with the the major players. Some do not involve any of the in-game characters at all and are simply interesting stories set in the world. They will write adventure stories, horror stories, detective stories, etc. They even have a story told from Terddy’s perspective (who is a 10-foot tall murderous teddy bear that is animated by the collected nightmares of children) and it was hilarious to read his deluded adventures in “happy magic land” that was actually a horrific murder spree.

          Overall I have just found that I don’t think Privateer Press’ fluff has evolved at all from what it started as. It was never terribly well written or overly imaginative. I do think that it was an interestingly built world at the start, and that made it more interesting in the beginning. But every year is more of the same. Right now I will give Wyrd a pass at doing the same thing because they are better at creating interesting and different narratives. Privateer Press has just built a fluff treadmill which is disguised as narrative but nothing of any real significance ever does happen. And they have not improved their writing styles or methods, so it became very tiring after a while. Now I simply don’t care at all what happens in their fluff.

          • Muninwing

            it works when your whole population is 10,000… like in a small city.

            it’s ludicrous on the national scale.

            it’s impossible on a galaxy scale.

          • EndreFodstad

            Might be worth taking another look then.

    • Cannibalbob

      They typically sell a yearly anthology book at around $40-43 for hardback and $30-33 for the softback. Every book is available in softback. It is also very easy to find significant discounts for Privateer Press products from online retailers. Privateer Press generally encourages purchases from FLGS and online retailers.

      Games Workshop actively works to prevent discount sources for their product, and they are not helpful for FLGS and try to sell as much of their stock as they can through their own stores or online sources – which gives them manufacturer, wholesale, and retailer profits. The fact that GW has such high margins on their products and still tries to charge higher prices than any other company is rather rediculous.

      So I think the GW to PP release style comparison sorta falls apart based on the massive price disparity,

    • Muninwing


      and i don’t like PP. which is why i played warhammer…

  • karloss01

    Whosoever holds this hammer, if he be worthy, shall possess the power of Sigmar.

  • Mordrot

    I hear the sarcasm but I really appreciate these reveals of important fluff because this new setting is being rolled out right before our eyes and it could make or break this setting for me.

  • Spacefrisian

    Its lacking the usual Blanchitsu stuff, thats a plus point if you ask me. (i am talking about those weird spots with penstrokes wildy scribbled around that and than claiming its a horse….or something.)

  • Mud_Duck

    Sigmar is a cat person, and Khorne is a dog kinda guy. Nagash? Birds.
    Felix and Gortex are Back! This time it’s the manling that is looking for his doom.
    The moon is made of 5 different types cheese and the Skaven are trying to burrow up to it, but just seems to keep hitting the other realms.

  • Alexander Thompson


  • zemlod

    -clears throat- . . . meh..

  • Haunter!

    I think the worst part of AoS’s fluff (aside from just throwing the Old World in the trash) is how they actually explain everything. There’s no ambiguity to anything, it’s just “Sigmar did all of this stuff exactly like this!” That takes the fun out of it.

    • Muninwing

      “the unassailable is the uninteresting” was the first lesson i learned in my college creative writing class…

  • James Hall

    “Ghal-Maraz – The fabled hammer, lost by Sigmar has been spotted in the realm of Chamon”

    The realm of Chamon? Is that the domain of Michael Jackson?