Age of Sigmar Minis – First Impressions


Get on your firegear – it’s going to be HOT on here.  The Age of Sigmar minis have been sighted and here are our 1st Impressions.

First of all, let’s get some basics out of the way:  Atia says this:

“Age of Sigmar Starter: Battle for the Gates of Azyr, Warriors of the God King vs Khorne, snap fit models, some of them are twice in the box”

I’m going to list off a big set of thoughts in no particular order:

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1) It’s all round bases (or ovals for the big guys) – say goodbye to square folks. At this point after all the leaks, hints, pics from Warhammer World, it should be a surprise to no one.

2) It sounds like it picks up right after the end times.  Listen to this quote: “The warriors of the God-King, unleashed upon shafts of magical lightning, have arrived in the Mortal Realsms, striking the first blow in a war of vengeance”  The first step in the God-King’s invasion is to open the Realmgames once more.”

3) If you recall, there were rumors for months of an all new “heavily armored army of men” that were supposed to be the WFB equivalent of Space Marines.  Well here they are.

4) The Forces of the God-King are in interesting aesthetic.  Those look to be bigger than a marine and smaller than a terminator.

5) Aesthetically – the design of the God-King’s forces draw from Blood Angels (Sanguinary guard), Mantic Basileans, Adeptus Custodes, classical Greek & Roman designs, and even a smidge of Warmachine Cygnar mixed in – also HAMMERTIME!

6) The Chaos forces seem much closer to the current Warriors of Chaos WFB range.  If anything the main differences are an increase in these “Shirtless blood farmers of Khorne” types who sit at the halfway point between the Marauders and Chaos Warriors.  The Khorne Skullreapers/Wrathmongers models releases in the End Times:Archaon book fit right in and were clearly harbingers of what was to come.

7) On all of these miniatures, GW has cranked up the level of detail.  Note the complex musculature on the “cultists” from the Khorne side, then look at the “detail on every square centimeter” of the fully armored Khorne warriors/warlord.  Also note the intricate details on both side’s standard bearers.  GW has definitely pulled out the stops on the technical detail of these kits.  They are clearly pushing the limits of injection molded plastic, aiming to impress potential customers with these minis. These minis are said to be “easy assembly” starter set type of minis.  If so, the technical design is even more impressive.

8) On the God-King’s side it looks completely different from anything WFB mortals had before.  This is effectively an entirely new range that completely breaks from the past.  We are very, very long way from the Empire & Bretonnia here.

9) The fluff in this product is also described as being all new, with all new battles, campaigns and histories.  It would appear that GW did indeed blow up the Old World, threw the important people through a Deus ex machina portal and are picking up the pieces with Age of Sigmar.

10) The existing WFB community is going to have a system shock to deal with this, but some points to consider.  As we have seen a million times, we need to wait to see these minis in the round.  How many times have we found minis to look so much more stunning in the round.  Additionally, note that Age of Sigmar is clearly an introductory game and not the “FULL GAME” that a 9th Edition rulebook would be.  Many have said that that product is coming quickly on it’s heels, so gamers should not rush to judge a limited scope introductory product by comparing it to something it was never meant to be.


Just breathe people.  Time will tell.  The only thing constant in the universe is indeed… change.

Also this will make you smile!



Do you think this product has the legs to revive WFB?


  • Dan

    My first impressions of the Sigmarites are that they are heavily influenced by Kings of War’s Basileans.

    • hamilton geyser

      I just looked that up and I have no idea how you came to that conclusion.

      • Dan

        Introducing Angels to Warhammer, Kings of War Basileans have the Elohi. The new Warhammer hero holding a warhammer and riding a giant cat, well check out Basileans Gnaeus Sallustis model (not to mention the Sisterhood Panther riders). Heavily armoured holy warriors, well Basileans have heavily armoured holy warriors in their Paladins as well. The whole angelic holy warrior ‘feel’ of the Sigmarites screams Basilea to me. The Sigmarites might not be an exact aesthetic copy but they seem heavily influenced by the Basileans to me.

        • Gunsheeplol

          The whole angel thing is way too generic for one company to claim as their own. GW have been doing it for decades with dark angels/blood angels anyway. And the character in the pics isn’t riding a giant cat, it’s actually more lizard/dragon thing if you look closely.

          • Talys

            At least nobody is calling it a rip-off of Dune this time.

            But seriously, “winged creatures” is hardly unique. I have winged Eldar going all the way to the 80s. More recently, there are Scourges, 2 Blood Angel heroes (Sanguinius, Astorath), and Sanguinary Guard. Off the top of my head.

          • Dan

            I’m not saying that Mantic are the first company to introduce Angels in their game, like you say Games Workshop have been doing it in 40k basically since it’s inception. However I think in this case Games Workshop has introduced Angels into Fantasy as a push back against Mantic. I think if we see a how holy angels verses demonic Chaos daemons in Warhammer Fantasy then that will definitely be in response to Kings of War’s Celestian angels verses Abyssal demons.

          • CoffeeGrunt

            Really? You think they didn’t just think, “how do we get across that these guys are really holy? F*ck it, Angels, that was easy.”

            GW probably don’t give a damn about Mantic’s range.

          • Dan

            Oh they give a huge damn about Mantic’s range because Mantic is a genuine competing company. Games Workshop’s sales decrease whilst Mantics popularity and sales continue to grow. Within ten years Mantic will pose a real threat to Games Workshop. Games Workshop would realise this because whilst they have made a lot of poor business decisions this past decade they aren’t complete f*cking retards. I’m sure they want to nip Mantics competition in the bud as soon as possible. That’s why we are seeing that Games Workshop looks as though they are about to release their rules sets online for free, they are doing that because that is Mantic’s strategy.

          • Retconned Legion

            Mantic relies entirely on people wanting a cheaper alternative to GW miniatures. Thats it. GW goes, so will Mantic.

            I wouldn’t read too much into GW releasing an AoS pdf. The description is of a 4 page document. Not exactly a full rulebook release.

          • Dan

            I disagree. If people were only flocking to Mantic because they want cheaper alternative miniatures for Warhammer then games like Deadzone and Dreadball wouldn’t be so popular. We will find out next year when they release Warpath which is forming a distinct visual style that is separate to that of 40k (as opposed to Kings of War which has a very similar visual style to Warhammer Fantasy) whether or not there is any truth to what you say. If Warpath proves to be popular then I will say that there are a lot of people are also turning to Mantic because they enjoy their games as well as people who just want cheap Warhammer mini’s.
            I don’t think Mantic will sink if Games Workshop does, on the contrary I think that 15 years from now we will see that companies like Mantic and Privateer Press will still be running healthily (in part due to their ability to change and adapt with the times, unlike Games Workshop who are set in their ways) where as Warhammer and 40k will be owned by Hasbro.
            Time will tell.

          • TweetleBeetle

            lol…oh my goodness you are delusional. None of that will happen. Privateer has slipped farther behind GW in the last two years…

            Ugh. Not worth the breath. Nothing you said is true.

          • Marky

            Maybe mantic were just waiting around for gw to do this so they could have a go at taking 10,000 fantasy players off gw.

          • Dan

            Mark my words, 15 years years from now Games Workshop won’t exist (and if it does exist it will be as a trade name under a parent company like Hasbro or Mattel). Where as companies like Mantic Games, Privateer Press, Battlefront Miniatures, Corus Belli, etc.. will still be going strong.

          • Davor Mackovic

            Herd this 15 years ago. Guess what. GW is still here 15 years later.

            GW is not going anywhere. While profits are not as big as before, they are still in the black, still making profit (how little that profit may be, but still a profit).

            No GW is not going anywhere, any time soon.

          • Dan

            No you didn’t hear that fifteen years ago and if you did hear that fifteen years ago then the people who were saying it were idiots. I’ll say to you what I said to ‘Secundrum’. Games Workshop was running a very profitable and stable business back in 2000. Back then they basically had a license to print money. However all
            that changed when they made the huge mistake of becoming a publicly
            traded company. When they became a publicly held company they had to
            start bending over backwards to keep the shareholders happy by
            constantly knocking out not well thought out products and raising prices
            to ensure that they can maintain profitable dividends for their
            investors (in constantly raising the prices they are slowly losing sales
            numbers, which will mean they’ll end up losing money and will increase
            shareholder pressure on the company). Being that they are a publicly
            traded company it also means that they are forced to do business in
            certain way and will not be able to change with the times. For instance
            they will never be able to hold any crowdfunding campaigns as it is
            illegal for publicly held companies to crowdfund (This is the only
            reason why we don’t see Games Workshop holding kickstarters).
            Crowdfunding is the way of the future, if Games Workshop hadn’t f*cked
            up and became a public company then they would be able to hold
            kickstarters for each of their releases and they would absolutely clean
            up if they were able to do that. I recon they would be able to raise
            tens of millions of dollars with each crowdfunding campaign if they were
            able to go via that route. Once they add retail profits on top of that
            Games Workshop would still be a very profitable business. But
            unfortunately they did become a publicly traded business (one that puts
            the shareholder before the hobbyist) and now they are slowly bleeding
            money. Other companies are able to adapt with the times and that’s why
            Mantic, Privateer, Corvus Belli, etc. will still be around in 15 years
            and Games Workshop won’t be

          • TweetleBeetle

            Yes, we heard this 15 years ago. We heard how everything they do is a “cash grab” and not a long term plan.

            Yet 40k is bigger than it ever has been. Then next 5 games combined aren’t even close.

            GW’s profit margin isn’t as big because Fantasy tanked, and they are producing way more product now than ever before. Increased production is expensive.

            And yet, GW is in the black. And their black is bigger than any other miniature company’s entire revenue stream.

            GW will still be here in 15 years, and still at the top. I know you have this hatred of GW and hope for them to fall (for whatever reason – and it’s all over all of your posts), but it won’t happen.

          • Dan

            No you didn’t hear what I said fifteen years ago, Games Workshop wasn’t a publicly traded company back then. Yes Games Workshop is in the BLACK and they are still making huge profits but if you have been paying attention to their finances you’ll notice that they have been making less and less profit each year. They will not be going bankrupt anytime soon which is why I estimated that it will take at least fifteen years for them to go under with their current business model. However with their current model they cannot remain in the BLACK forever, if their profit continues to drop eventually they will go into the RED. You need not worry though as I doubt Warhammer and 40k will disappear, the IP will probably be bought up by a company like Hasbro or Mattel.

          • jeff white

            you sir are the cassandra to the fanboy agamemnon

          • Muninwing

            you will also note that GW started having some serious issues in 2008… the year that the US plunged the world into a global economic crisis, and one of the largest markets for games and hobbies was hit by huge spikes in unemployment, bankruptcy, home foreclosures, and economic uncertainty.

            and the generation that graduated from college in the following few years changed their spending habits due to their inability to join the workforce.

            those new customers were investments — the kids who loved macragge, who may have shelved their collections in college and were counted on to rediscover their old love when they started earning enough money to actually participate at the level they always wanted to (and that many claim makes it too expensive, despite the gradual kit-by-kit pace that makes it possible to build many thousands of points over a decade). those investments never came to fruition.

            this is why every amateur and couch-economist should not be reading and commenting knowingly on the GW financial reports. there are tons of factors involved. and yes, some of that is the publicly shared nature of the company now, but it goes far deeper than that and incorporates a ton of other factors.

            plus, they always make ridiculous slippery-slope predictions. it gets old.

          • AdeptusAstartes

            Belatedly, but still valid ….

            Back to your books boy, GW were floated in the mid 90s, they announced the exclusive world wide lotr licence in 99/2000 and their share price trebled almost overnight.

            And the demise of GW has been foretold by industry commentators since before the stock exchange flotation.

            So join the long line of ney sayers, somewhere near the back.

          • jeff white


            (one that puts
            the shareholder before the hobbyist)

            and the rest,
            all true…

          • jeff white

            yup, i see this in the cards too if left under current management surely these are the new toys r us trash

          • Retconned Legion

            If they want to do that, they should hire better sculptors. Cheaper or not, the vast bulk of their stuff looks like Gary Morley did it.

          • CoffeeGrunt

            Mantic pose a threat? I dunno personally as I never see their models or games played locally, nor their terrain, but elsewhere I guess they might be.

            Where do they even compete?

          • Dan

            I guess they haven’t reached your local wargaming community yet. I’d imagine that with their growing popularity within the next five years you’ll be seeing more and more of their stuff showing up within your community, maybe not as much as Games Workshop’s stuff but it will probably be as common as Privateer Press stuff or Flames of War stuff by then. (If it isn’t then I will owe you a coke 😛 )
            Kings of War is pretty popular amongst my gaming circles in the Hunter Valley and Central Coast areas on the east coast of Australia. I think Mantic does very well in England and throughout Europe. I think they are also getting a bit of a following in America as well.

          • CoffeeGrunt

            Hmm, Kings isn’t popular among the ex-WFB crew we have here who would be the best candidates Deadzone and Dreadball simply failed to gain interest, same with Mars Attacks.

            Batman’s popular, as is 40K and WarmaHordes, naturally. Also Magic, a little Yu-Gi-Oh, and a couple of other games.

          • Dan

            I must admit that Mars Attacks has kind of failed amongst my gaming circles as well.
            Still I hope for my sake Mantic products do take off in your area within the next five years, otherwise I’ll have to somehow track you down with that can of coke… which could prove to be very expensive depending on where you live in the world. 😛

          • Wolfgang Piranhafishthethird

            Dan, you clearly know nothing about what you are talking about mate.

            I am an old geezer, approaching 50 and happen to live in Nottingham 20 mins walk from GW HQ. I own models from Citadel when they first produced them and have friends who have worked at the HQ for over 21yrs. There is a hell of a lot wrong with GW in as far as its attitude to old timers, but it has done a lot right and very well for gamers over the decades too. It has some very healthy long term strategies and unfortunately your hatred is blinding you to the real big picture, they spend more on R&D than most other companies take in revenue. They will not be needing any help from hasbro etc for the next 30 years, so save your breath mate.

            As for Mantic I speak to Ronnie and the guys from time to time and like their stuff which is getting better as they find their way.

            A word to the wise!

            Stick to stuff that you actualy know something about because you come across as a fool to anyone who has had any serious experience of dealing with those people who run the companies that you are talking about!


          • jeff white

            sometimes being too close to the inner circle is no blessing. if the management puts gw in a position that attracts the attention of a bigger plastic doll factory like hasbro and is able to leverage a buyout of shares with a fat check to top investors, then that is what will happen. and, from the outside looking in, this certainly appears to be the mid-term strategy. that is unless the top bosses at gw are different from the rest of the western neo-classically educated mba ceo/cfo/coo set, and identify with the company and its mission rather than the shareholders and their own personal end-game, that being a bubble-up pump-n-dump then their last thirty years of life on yaughts filled with mdma and 23year old venezuelan party girls… but then again, you know these people, so tell us all that this is truly not the case…

          • Dan

            And I’m sure they are great guys in real life mate, but the actual numbers in their financial report aren’t on Games Workshop’s side.

          • Muninwing

            how well do you know the reality of those numbers? do you run your own business? are you an accountant?

            GW’s numbers have been hit by numerous factors, yet they still have made a profit. you reading a report summary from your living room is a far cry from the reality those numbers represent.

          • An_Enemy

            They’re making a slim profit because they gutted their retail locations and fired a ton of people two years ago. Most stores, in the US at least, are open four days a week from 11 am to 9pm and even those hours are subject to which day we’re specifically talking about.

            This is all in their reports. It’s all over the internet because they’re a publically traded company.

            All this exists outside of the fantasy land a lot of you live in where sales are booming which its been PROVEN is not the case by GW’s own shareholder releases.

            I’m not going to say GW is tanking. I’m saying GW is panicking and they refuse to calm the F down. They are drifting with no land in sight, holding the only gun in the life raft and sizing up their faithful customers chanting under their breath, “the weak are meat for the strong to eat.”

          • jeff white

            i think that you are correct but i also think that management at gw has an end in sight, and it is a pump n dump branding split and sellout for short term personal gain.

          • Muninwing

            this theory has circulated for years now, and they’ve done quite a few things that hint otherwise…

          • Muninwing

            i would panic too if my cash cow was suddenly vomiting blood.

            i do think that their strategy, however muddled it may have become, has not panned out yet in 40k. they announced with the inception of 6th that they wanted to change their business model — that they wanted to update the game, then change to a different model for releasing new rules.

            the need to release 7th as a patch for 6th notwithstanding, they are almost done. soon, we will see what they plan on doing after all armies are refreshed and current, and how they plan on keeping the game alive. fans spent years lamenting outdated underpowered books — now, everyone fits, and any rebalancing may be done with new units, new ideas, or FAQs. they can develop campaigns with new models and units as bolstering elements. dataslates can add interest and variance. and they need never release a new rulebook (or at least not for a very long time, unless this plan bombs).

            they’re what — about a year? — away from being done with this idea, and Stormclaw becoming a new trend. and with WHF and the new skirmish game trying to change the pace of the other half of the company, they have a chance at building a great setup with some great longterm potential. my hope is that this is the plan of the current CEO, and when he’s seen to its implementation, they’ll hand off the reins to someone with more vision and passion.

            only time will tell.

          • Sh4d0wProph3t

            Similar crowd in my area. No Mantic players at my local FLG. 40k, X-wing, Malifaux, Magic and a dedicated Bolt Action crowd. Quite a few regular games of Zombicide too. Mantic/Infinity simply don’t get a look in.

          • Muninwing

            malifaux took off here for about six months. most people bought a single faction, were distracted with it for a bit, then went on their way.

            x-wing has a dedicated core group, and it’s grown. but of the artists and the modelers crowd, none of them bother.

            we have two or three guys who do FoW and Bolt Action, both older ex-military. sometimes someone joins up with them, but they rarely stay with it.

            no infinity players. warmahordes and dystopian wars both used to have their dedicated groups, but they either started showing up to play 40k again or they stopped showing up.

            magic has its own day, and is a larger draw than all the tabletop strategy games.

            past that, it’s 90% 40k, 10% Fantasy.

          • An_Enemy

            Talk someone into splitting a box of Infinity’s Operation Icestorm. You’ll be surprised how fast it grows in your area once people start drifting over to the tables.

            It’s just an all around better game imo. I play both. If someone suggests a game of 40k I’m down…then I ask what armies we’re bringing

            If someone suggest a game of Infinity I say, “hell yes,” and start grabbing terrain.

          • Secundum

            People have been saying that for years, and I have yet to see a single mantic/kings of war/etc. in any gaming community here in the UK.

          • Dan

            Well you are based in the UK, where as I’m based in Australia so you would know better than I. However when I look at the community walk map looking for Mantic players it looks like there are a hell of a lot of players and clubs in the UK that play Mantic games. The amount of people and groups listed on this map would only be a fraction of a fraction of the total people that play as well.

          • Secundum

            True, but compared to GW, that’s a mere drop in the ocean. No matter what people say, GW doesn’t have any true competitors.

          • Dan

            Sure Games Workshop is still the big fish for now but their sales continue to drop each year, they are slowly bleeding money. The Games Workshop empire is burning. I shall respond to you by repeating what I said to Marky. ‘Mark my words, 15 years years from now Games Workshop won’t exist (and
            if it does exist it will be as a trade name under a parent company like
            Hasbro or Mattel). Where as companies like Mantic Games, Privateer
            Press, Battlefront Miniatures, Corus Belli, etc.. will still be going

          • Secundum

            You know, people said Geedubs was doomed about 15 years ago. HMMMMMM……

          • Dan

            No they didn’t and if people were saying that back in 2000 then they were idiots as Games Workshop was running a very profitable and stable business back then. Back then they basically had a license to print money. However all that changed when they made the huge mistake of becoming a publicly traded company. When they became a publicly held company they had to start bending over backwards to keep the shareholders happy by constantly knocking out not well thought out products and raising prices to ensure that they can maintain profitable dividends for their investors (in constantly raising the prices they are slowly losing sales numbers, which will mean they’ll end up losing money and will increase shareholder pressure on the company). Being that they are a publicly traded company it also means that they are forced to do business in certain way and will not be able to change with the times. For instance they will never be able to hold any crowdfunding campaigns as it is illegal for publicly held companies to crowdfund (This is the only reason why we don’t see Games Workshop holding kickstarters). Crowdfunding is the way of the future, if Games Workshop hadn’t f*cked up and became a public company then they would be able to hold kickstarters for each of their releases and they would absolutely clean up if they were able to do that. I recon they would be able to raise tens of millions of dollars with each crowdfunding campaign if they were able to go via that route. Once they add retail profits on top off that Games Workshop would still be a very profitable business. But unfortunately they did become a publicly traded business (one that puts the shareholder before the hobbyist) and now they are slowly bleeding money. Other companies are able to adapt with the times and that’s why Mantic, Privateer, Corvus Belli, etc. will still be around in 15 years and Games Workshop won’t be.

          • Davor Mackovic

            While yes GW had a licence to print money people said GW demise was poor written rules, lack of support and prices being raised every year.

            GW what GW is still hear. Now that GW is loosing money, well not loosing money since they are still in the black, but not getting as much money as they did, people are trying to say it’s their demise.

            GW is not in RED. They are still in the BLACK. They don’t owe anyone any money (that I know of) so GW is not going Bankrupt anytime soon. So they will not be going anywhere anytime soon either.

          • Dan

            Not anytime soon, which is why I estimate it will take at least 15 years for them to go bankrupt under their current model. They are still making a profit however their profit becomes less and less each year, they can not maintain this forever, eventually they will go into the RED.

          • Snord

            Yes, Dan, they did say that. Very little new has been said about GW in the last 15 years. As for your prediction that PP will still be going strong when GW is gone, I think PP will need to get past the 1990s in terms of model design (and discovery injection moulded polystyrene) or they’re going to fall by the wayside.

          • Dan

            Well I was hugely into both Warhammer Fantasy and 40k back 2000 and I can’t recall anyone predicting Games Workshop’s doom back then. Mind you I guess I was only 14 back then so maybe I just wasn’t paying attention. Ok I’ll give you guys the benefit of a doubt and accept that people were saying it back then. However the people who were saying back then were idiots who weren’t basing it on much (like I say they basically had a license to print money back then). The people who say it these days based on their annual finances and observations of the constant increase of more and more competing companies starting up and having the ability to utilize crowdfunding, well the people who predict Games Workshops doom based on these factors are not idiots and they are probably going to be proven right in the long run.

          • TweetleBeetle

            Their sales haven’t dropped each year. Fantasy dropped each year, while 40k grew.

            Now Age of Sigmar will fix the Fantasy problem, while also crushing the emerging skirmish game companies.

          • Dan

            I doubt it, I think you’ll see a sudden surge in sales for Fantasy but then they’ll drop off and Games Workshop will be worse off than they were before. Basically they have lost a hell of a lot of their loyal fantasy players by destroying the Warhammer world and given that they could barely market fantasy to players before they probably won’t be able to do any better with 9th edition in the long run by way of attracting new players. Once people are sick of Age of Sigmar Warhammer Fantasy will go the way of the Dodo. Unless they retcon everything and bring back ‘Warhammer Classic’, which I wouldn’t put past them. (Remember what happened to White Wolf when they killed off their old World of Darkness line, it was a disaster for them. They had short run of big profitable sales with Vampire: The Requiem and what not but then people didn’t want anything to do with the game. It basically killed White Wolf (that and merging with CCP games). Onyx Path (a different company from White Wolf) had to retcon the classic World of Darkness line so they can make a profit. It seems Games Workshop didn’t learn from White Wolf’s mistake, Warhammer Fantasy is going to die over the next few years. I’ll be very surprised if we see a 10th edition.)

          • An_Enemy

            So sayeth the guy that has no integrity whatsoever here.

            Listen up people. This is real truth folks! Until a month or two from now when he has a completely different brand of snakeoil to sell.

          • jeff white

            dinosaurs had no competitors. gm had no competitors. yup…

          • An_Enemy

            Yeah…just like the US doesn’t have any true competitors. Until you ask someone outside of the US.

          • Secundum

            That’s because Americans are generally pretty stupid. Sure, you get the occasional bright spark, but by and large they all genuinely believe that the USA is awesome. It’s kinda pitiful really.

          • Retconned Legion

            Never seen a store even carrying Mantic stuff, let alone people playing it.

          • Dan

            We’re out there.

          • Davor Mackovic

            4 pages of rules? I wouldn’t be too thrilled with that. Sounds as if GW is trying to give as little as possible.

            While I think this is a great idea, I just don’t see how 4 pages of rules is any good especially when Fantasy/40K had 100 pages of rules.

            So how do you make a game from 100 pages down to 4? It almost sounds like intro rules very basic. While other companies give out complete rules for free, giving out 4 pages means GW is really not that concerned.

            Doesn’t Mantic give out their rules for free? If yes, then GW is really not that worried. After all GW didn’t do much when Privateer Press started. Look what happened to Fantasy now.

          • Dan

            If Games Workshop aren’t worried by what other companies do then they would be even dumber than they already seem. I don’t think they are so stupid as to ignore what the competition does.

          • The rules in the aos box arent the full 9th ed rules, just a get you by pamphlet.

          • TweetleBeetle

            GW doesn’t care about Mantic at all. GW’s sales weren’t decreasing – at least not with 40k. Fantasy was dying, sure, but GW could literally spend the sales of one Space Marine release to buy Mantic’s miniature game.

          • Dan

            And Mantic would be very foolish to sell it to them considering they are a constantly growing business.

          • Jonathan B.

            Who is Mantic?

          • Nathaniel Wright

            Mold-lines, the miniatures company.

          • jeff white

            of course, you are correct in this assessment… predators will try to look as much like the non-predatory prey animal in order to manage the environment through deceit. mantic fills a void left when gw had its heart ripped through some banker’s wallet more than decade ago. so gw is blurring the lines between what it does and boardgames of all sorts generally all at once while at the same time hopefully revamping its large scale rules system to adjoin these small scale rules and herd its receding customer base back into its corral, where it is again free to feed at will. fanboys with blinders simply cannot see the big picture, cuz gw is god and if not they have given their souls to something less so it simply cannot be otherwise…

          • Muninwing

            i’ll be impressed when i see another company come out with kits that are (a) that detailed (b) that customizable (c) that varied.

            you cry out with cheap rhetoric (reminiscent of college sophomores debating the evils of a modern society they have been sheltered from). and you downplay with broad sweeping (and arrogant) generalizations the real reasons why GW has the fans that it does — show me another company with the quality product that appeals to modelers, lore-lovers, painters, kitbashers, modders, traditionalists, all at once.

            warmahordes got the initial “we’re not GW” boost that was unsustainable and based on no real substance. Wyrd is still struggling to hold on to its own marketshare while trying to shake the shame of some of their early products. mantic is mostly used for unit filler for warhammer players, or as a temporary alternative when the gw shift swings back to 40k by the non-scifi players.

            though i will give you credit — you stopped short of making yourself a walking cliche, but you’re one “sheeple” away from being just sad…

          • jeff white

            i am sorry to try your patience. of course, ad hominem aside, you defend the status quo against the winds of change. your prerogative. but this is the point – i am a fan of warhammer, as is everyone who spends time in discourse on these boards, reading blogs, living the hobby however distantly. and this is again the point – “gw” has few fans left. warhammer has as many and maybe more than it ever did. but the company is losing the faith of old men like myself, and it is old men like myself who got me into the community 20 years ago, as it would be the old men like me who bring in new recruits. gw wants to be a model company, great. but who supports their products after they leave the shelves? old men like me. we provide the examples, tutor the rules as well as principles of gameplay, mentor in the fine art of meta-level reasoning over rules systems so that the time that we spend around the gaming table inspires the time that we spend at the modeling table and this brings us back to the killer models that gw has been able to produce and sure, you are right about this… for now. gw makes the best kits – now. we may comfortably project that other companies – perhaps crowdfunded startups – will be afforded increasing access to not only the design software behind gw products, now, but also the injection molding systems (perhaps by way of offshore companies who are, due to other economic factors, not as busy as they used to be and looking for such arrangements to secure their own futures) required to ‘print on demand’ these designs which might at once be shipped from the production site. low overhead. cooperative. decentralized (why not produce at satellite subcontractors regionally local to consumers?). this sort of business model is clearly superior to gw’s model, now. look, the information age has made (potential) producers of all of us. we can each publish, easily, recently get funding to make material reality of ideas, easily. and – unless the dinosaurs in the world start ww3 in order to keep things the way that they are, which is looking increasingly likely in the real world of political economy) this trend should continue. why shouldn’t i subcontract the production of my own personal designs to be used in gw and other games? why shouldn’t plastics companies open themselves to these opportunities as technologies permit? fact is, they will. the community will recover from gw mismanagement. warhammer won’t die. and gw might go on forever, in some form or other, but it is no longer the company that it once was, and though i and everyone else here remain in love with the warhammer universe, and gw is making some good stuff, this is to be balanced against misuse of rules systems for marketing purposes, and basically positioning as the microsoft of the games community. i mean, look, i am an ethicist. a machine ethicist, a philosopher of cognitive science and AI. i am no spring chicken, and i felt moral horor at the thought o recasters only a couple of years ago. now, i encourage the idea, and not because i lost any love for warhammer. rather, because i am not a fan of the ethos driving gw corporate. this entire segment of the world economy, and everyone involved, once cut from humanity will prove only a benefit. latter day corporate capitalism is a dismal failure, aiming as it always has for the financial fascism that is currently tearing at the very fabric of society from greece to brazil. gw directors are aiming to keep themselves in the 1%. they do so at the expense of everything that i hold sacred in this hobby, and for that, these men and women can rot. warhammer and the community which supports it will be better off once their true colors are obvious, and they have no recourse but to run from the pitchforks heading, increasingly their way.

          • Muninwing

            “you defend the status quo against the winds of change.”

            and you are attacking the “big guy” as the evil big brother regardless of the veracity of that concept.

            what’s more, if there were so few fans left, why are their limited editions selling out in the same day as release?

            i’m a moderate in many ways, and i see all too many people attacking the concept of establishment for the sake of railing against authority. it’s the flip side of the flaw of always believing the establishment because they are the authority. same foolishness, same partisan motivation, same intolerant extreme.

            what’s funny is that depending on the source, you see lots of people complaining, or you see lots of people lauding how much they love their hobby. you see lots of complainers, armchair economists, and freebie-demanders comparing one small portion of the business plan to vastly different smaller companies (without any consideration of the bigger picture). it gets old fast.

            the purpose of a company, of a corporation, is to make money. they do this better with a happier customer base. but the customer base for miniatures games is immature, irrational, selfish, and egotistical (if you remember the old GW-run forums, you know what i mean).

            the man who coined the phrase “the customer is always right” went bankrupt. twice.

            your rhetoric is strongly anticorporate, taking over from that playbook rather than staying on topic here. i’d point this out if it was strongly pro-corporate too. you’re all the same to me – an extremist is an extremist, and you’re headed there.

            oh… and the “moral horror” at recasters… remember that there’s a well-documented link between chinese-based forgeries of other luxury goods and organized crime… and the drug trade, and the human traffciking trade. so be wary of who you are giving your money to and what they use it to later fund… crusading against the corprocracy for their business-based decisions in a business market is only so much ethical fuel to propel you forward before you have to look at the bigger picture.

            do i like GW policy? it’s largely Bee Ess. they are a game company as much as a model company. they got lazy and pooped on their goose — i will forever be disgusted with what Mat Ward did to the game with his terrible writing and balancing, screwing up both WHF and 40k in the latter part of 5th.

            but PP is now adopting many of the established patterns of GW. the “we’re the new rebels” company has realized how unsustainable that is. mantic is still not putting out the quality product i had hoped they would. and a ton of GW’s new stuff is top-notch.

            GW has gone through some sketchy moments. their leadership has changed a few times. they don;t seem to have one person with a prominent vision of WHF, or of 40k, coordinating the overarcing ideas. and their new CEO doesn’t sound like he’s much better. but the funy thing about the “winds of change” is that they are by nature fickle and change course. predicting that in ten years GW will be no more and that other companies will rise to prominence is not foolish from a childlike devotion to a corporate identity, but from a pragmatic position: if in two years, they have not fixed their still-existing problems, they will make changes themselves. and as PP has shown, any other company rising will have issues — their sales are down, their stake in the market share is not dependable, and the dip in GW sales in favor of other companies correlates to the “it’s too expensive” rhetoric combined with economic struggle factors — and the more those rebound, the clearer a picture of the actual market we will see. so a guess of four or five years down the road is far too blurry to depend upon, never mind a ten-year hyperbole.

            there are plenty of legitimately terrible people running corporations, allowing atrocities to occur if their wallets are padded. GW is tame by comparison. they are guilty of increasing their prices (often in line with inflation, particularly in the US), a lazy work-ethic with their playtesting and balancing, not crowdsourcing their rules or playtesting or the like, and asking for money for their products instead of giving them away for free like some others do. no poisoned groundwater, no cancer-ridden children, so sex slaves. pretty tame.

            and the last time they crowdsourced their FAQs, the idiot that wrote them included a “whatever you want to do!” clause with a rambling justification. so i can understand why they wouldn’t want to go that route again.

            this is, i suppose, a huge issue. and i hate oversimplification for the benefit of the easily-distracted and intellectually unfit. so i applaud you putting it all on the table. but you’re bringing a TON of external baggage (everything about the 1% and all the biased rhetoric) that is clouding the issue instead of clearing the view.

            i’ve been teaching for 14 years, and teaching rhetoric and argument for over a decade. i understand that ethics are an important aspect to the big picture. but they are also largely personal, and as such highly subjective.

          • jeff white

            >>i’ve been teaching for 14 years, and teaching rhetoric and argument for over a decade.

            maybe so, but you are not very good at it.

            >>and you are attacking the “big guy” as the evil big brother regardless of the veracity of that concept.what’s more, if there were so few fans left, why are their limited editions selling out in the same day as release.

            again, you cloud the issue. gw corporate has few fans. maybe you are the only one, and your pals who work for them (likely auditors and accountants). warhammer, however, is a different story – maybe more fans than ever due to multimedia and print.

            >>i’m a moderate in many ways, and i see all too many people attacking the concept of establishment for the sake of railing against authority.

            this is not what i am doing.

            >>the purpose of a company, of a corporation, is to make money.

            no. the purpose of a corporation is to enable good people to do great things, together. only recently have these “great things” been reduced to only one ludicrous industry, to “make money”. the only corporation the purpose of which is to “make money” is a private central bank. even a public bank issuing currency sans interest exists for the purpose of supporting the natural economy. note i say here “natural”. and if you do not understand why this is important then i suggest that you re-read Aristotle’s Politics (the part about economies, viciousness, and “the worst kind of animal” being, essentially, the man whose purpose is to “make money”) and if you don’t understand the purpose of a corporation – and you don’t – then i suggest that you re-read the history of corporations and how the original purpose of corporations and then study on how this purpose has been transformed, since, by “capital” (people whose sole purpose is to make money) in order to serve said “capital (these same people). as i understand that this may be too much to ask, i will make things simple: a prosocial public tool has been coopted by the wealthy and the greedy to serve them alone against the public (people who are not driven to “make money” as their sole purpose) and now you take this to be “normal” when – in fact Aristotle and the ancients had already understood (as, he tells us, they had already SEEN such idiocy play out, with expected results) this – this “normal” is an unhealthy, vicious extreme.

            >>what’s funny is that depending on the source, you see lots of people complaining, or you see lots of people lauding how much they love their hobby.

            again, you cloud the issue. the hobby and gw corporate are (increasingly) two very different things.

            >>oh… and the “moral horror” at recasters… remember that there’s a well-documented link between chinese-based forgeries of other luxury goods and organized crime… and the drug trade, and the human traffciking trade.

            uh, yeah, right – you forgot “terrorism”. right. slippery slope nonsense.

            >>do i like GW policy? it’s largely Bee Ess. they are a game company as much as a model company. they got lazy and pooped on their goose — i will forever be disgusted with what Mat Ward did to the game with his terrible writing and balancing, screwing up both WHF and 40k in the latter part of 5th.

            i will drink to that.

            >>GW has gone through some sketchy moments. their leadership has changed a few times. they don;t seem to have one person with a prominent vision of WHF, or of 40k, coordinating the overarcing ideas. and their new CEO doesn’t sound like he’s much better.

            now that you have disentangled the hobby from corporate, you are making sense. bravo.

            >>but the funy thing about the “winds of change” is that they are by nature fickle and change course.

            my assertion – if they had stayed on track, cultivated the culture, rewarded loyalty, maybe made some mistakes but all is good, they would be forgiven, then the winds (the spirit of the community) would not be changing against them. the trouble is that gw came to be piloted by people who were taught that the sole purpose of a corporation is to “make money” and this, again recalling Aristotle, is vicious, ignorant, and ultimately unhealthy both for the agent (in this case gw corporate) and its host (the social-political economy as a whole). there is no way to pull these issues apart – gw does not exist in a vacuum, and is certainly NOT the only company losing public faith. see for example McDonald’s plummeting sales, the rising tides against GMO poisoning and cancer-causing chemical from Monsanto and Dow and Syngenta, the boycotts of Israeli companies profiting on apartheid (Sodastream, for example), never mind Microsoft and Google (Startpage, anyone?)… this list goes on and on AND it is growing, and will continue to grow as people become increasingly informed as to exactly what and WHO is driving this global economy into neo-feudalism via financial fascism. this is not “extreme”, it is a natural, healthy FACT as the human system seeks to regain a healthy, natural balance (again, re-reading Aristotle may help, here).

            >>and the last time they crowdsourced their FAQs, the idiot that wrote them included a “whatever you want to do!” clause with a rambling justification. so i can understand why they wouldn’t want to go that route again.

            actually, i understand this to be the current attitude at gw – ‘hey, they are your models (after you pay our exorbitant prices for them) so yeah, do what you want!’

            >>but you’re bringing a TON of external baggage (everything about the 1% and all the biased rhetoric) that is clouding the issue instead of clearing the view.

            i disagree. understanding the psychology driving the people who drive companies like gw is essential to understanding the increasing divide between gw corporate and the hobbyists on whose efforts gw corporate’s sole goal to “make money” is realized. the 1% consists of people driven by a similar psychology, and current latter-day corporate capitalism continues to b morphed in support of this psychology (see, for example, the TPP currently under works).

            see, the world economy is driven by extremists for the benefit of extremists. it is a “pathocracy” and the truth of this matter is increasingly obvious to everyone regardless of station. to reject such extremism is not be be an extremist, it is rather to seek to regain the healthy balance between human beings and the natural environment that ultimately supports every project that human beings undertake. this is the true nature of the ‘winds of change’ so evident from Greece to the BDS movement to the anti-GMO movement to the anti-vaccine movement to the pro-organic movement to the Occupy movement and so on. these are not “extremists” though they may seem this way for anyone invested in things staying the way that they currently are. given these winds of change, IF gw corporate were run by non-idiots, then they would position themselves on the right side of history, the side of those who will continue to populate the gaming tables long after the transition to a sustainable, non-pathological economy is effected, and they would NOT position themselves as the Microsoft of the gaming industry. sure, this is a “revolutionary” idea, to act justly and in the interests of the community at large, but it is only an “extreme” idea in an already diseased social-political economy that is in need of dramatic change. change is always “extreme” for those resistant to change. and those who resist change are doomed to break in the face of it. here, i suggest that you re-read the Tao te Ching.


          • Muninwing

            “Mantic is a genuine competing company”

            in other news, the Zune is deemed genuine competition for the ipod, and the warhammer MMO is dubbed “the WoW killer”


            armchair economists are about as effective as amrchair coaches before the internet meant you could immediately look up stats.

          • Muninwing

            i think you overestimate mantic’s clout…

          • Muninwing

            i would say that if they’re ripping anyone off, it’s John Milton, not Mantic.

            angels vs demons? big-time trope older than steam power.

          • dodicula

            Doesnt mean GW wont try

          • Gary Findlay

            So you are exactly right, its all been done before.

            I seem to remember rackhams confrontation to the whole angels verse demons thing rather well back in 2005/6.

            I for one am excited and can’t wait for my paint brushes to abuse them horribly.

        • dodicula

          Yep, looks like GW has moved on from ripping off tolkien to ripping off Mantic. Cant wait for them to try to sue mantic for infringing on “GW’ intellectual property

        • Retconned Legion

          Is it a cat he’s riding? I can’t actually tell.

          • Dan

            I think it is but I could be mistaken, it’s hard to tell in this photo.

        • TweetleBeetle

          That’s a stretch. Plus these models from GW actually look good.

          • Dan

            How can you tell when it’s not a very good photo? Actually judging by what I can make out I think these mini’s are pretty crap compared to some of the other great mini’s that Games Workshop puts out.

        • Muninwing

          ” The new Warhammer hero holding a warhammer and riding a giant cat, well check out Basileans Gnaeus Sallustis model ”

          give him a sword and start quoting 80s cartoons….

          there’s so many archetypes that the current mode is referencing, that doesn’t make one a copy of the other (though it means they are copying the same twelve disparate sources, or six of the same and six more from a list of twenty that are all in the same family)…

          • Dan

            Ok I will start quoting 80’s cartoons because there is truth to that as well. He-Man is who Mantic originally ripped-off when they decided to put Sisters on Panthers. Games Workshop are still taking influence from Mantic Games for their Sigmarites. Let set one thing straight with everyone who seems to be pissed off at me for pointing out that Games Workshop is taking influence from Mantic. I’m not saying that it is at all a bad thing if they are doing that (all artists take inspiration from somewhere), all I’m saying is that it is ironic that people always complain that Mantic steal their visual style for Kings of War from Warhammer (which is true, Mantic does do this) only to have Warhammer in turn steal influence from Kings of War. It’s ironic and that’s all I intended my original point to be.

          • Muninwing

            … and what i was trying to say was that if mantic copied from numerous sources, there’s a strong possibility that GW copied those sources instead of mantic.

            it’s like when that silly “vampire diaries” show aired,and people were claiming that they were just copying twilight… even though they’d been based on books written in the 80s (my wife read them as a kid, she thought it was hilarious).

            or like when internet trolls claimed that GW was copying PP by adding one-use powers (despite a ton of one-use powers in the game from the beginning).

            or like when people claimed that GW was just ripping off Tolkein — yes, by nature of creating a fantasy world that had demi-humans in it, they were copying some of his aesthetic by being in the same genre… but Tolkein himself, the linguist and historian, used source material himself that was incorporated into the GW aesthetic.

            i hate when people jump quickly to the “they’re just ripping off x” argument. for every time that it’s right, there are ten where it’s far more complicated than that.

            oh, and even though mechanical wings have been part of models (either functionally like the DE scourges, or aesthetically like the Seraphim and the BA) for over twice as long as Mantic has even been a company, i’d be far more willing to believe that they were copying Awake Realms’ “The Edge” models than Mantic’s… actual quality minis as opposed to the disproportionate face and hand sculpts that make mantic look so clownish.

    • tibbyvc

      Also to be fair these models put anything Manti has ever produced to shame…

      • Dan

        Well we can’t see them very well in the picture but in my opinion I think they aren’t all that great. I think Games Workshop has put out a lot prettier mini’s than their Age of Sigmar mini’s.

        • 40kgamer

          These are pretty good for snap fit. Looks to me like they are really shooting for the kid crowd with this starter set, which is a good thing for them if they can pull it off.

    • PrimoFederalist

      I agree 100%. I don’t know or care about Mantic v GW, but I’ve seen that range before and when I saw the warriors of Sigmar, the Basileans were the first thing that came to mind.

    • Gary Findlay

      Which in turn look like the griffon faction from confrontation.

  • Christie Bryden

    the forces of the god king look cool and all, but GW seem to be falling into the trap of only producing khorne and nurgle again, one of the best parts of chaos was the 4 gods and each having there own assthetic, but in the last 10 years they have clearly had a emphesis on khorne and nurgle especialy khorne, I know in a time of war hes ment to be the strongest, but since end times archeon just realesed a bunch of khorne and then we had demon kin, can we maybe give tzentch and slannesh a time in the spotlight?

    dosnt seem hard, think you can have super arcane mysthical knights for tzentch.

    • CoffeeGrunt

      I remember a quote saying they struggle to translate Tzeentch and Slaanesh to the tabletop. Primarily because one of them is about manipulating fate, so unless you give them Re-Roll Everything you’re just stuck spamming Space Wizards.

      Slaanesh just involves attaching whips and chains to stuff.

      • Theik

        It wouldn’t be too hard to translate “fate” into rule mechanics, especially considering Tzeentch isn’t above screwing his own buddies over if it suits him.

        Simply adding some RNG effects to tzeentch units where most of the times something good happens and sometimes something bad happens would do the trick.

        • CoffeeGrunt

          Hmmm, but there’s enough of that in Codex Daemons, to be fair, and y’know how people like to whine that too much is decided by dice rolls in 40K…

        • Christie Bryden

          yes but they seem bad at doing rng with tezentch the reprocusions end up so bad you are put off using them completly, tezentch should be better than what everyone else has most the time if there is the chance bad stuff happens, but most of it is 50% the same other people have or worse. 50% much worse.

        • Ben_S

          Maybe ‘translating to the tabletop’ means into models, rather than rules.

          It’s hard to produce a model that represents formless change (though Tzeentch does have various tropes: eyes, feathers, etc).

          Slaanesh is easy, just not child-audience-friendly.

      • Deathmage

        Tzeentch could do with a more warp flame style, and in the rules have them able to regenerate wounds which fits with the warpflame. Slaanesh a beautiful evil style would fit the deamons, giving them rules to mess around with and require leadership would fit that.

        • CoffeeGrunt

          Seduction’s tough to pull off, and a Keep of Secrets really ought to be able to react to an opponent better than she does currently. Bonuses to Seize at least? If she knows your soul, she knows you.

          • Deathmage

            I just dont think the horrible creation style works for them

      • 6Cobra

        All they/you have to do is look at the range of Chaos Champions of Slaanesh and Tzeentch from the RT era to see that it is actually really easy to make fantastic looking, bespoke and compelling minis for both those gods. When I cracked open my very first Warhammer catalogue in about 1992 it was the champions of Slaanesh and Tzeentch I found to look the coolest. I couldn’t for the life of me understand why anybody wanted the Nurgle guys..

        • CoffeeGrunt

          Was this in the era where they still had leopard print paint schemes? Asking as 1992 pre-dates my existence. 🙂

      • Christie Bryden

        yes but then that is forgetting hes also the god of magic in fantasy, as said very easy to have really strong magical knights, think medival thousand sons but less egyptian, if they are struggeling with some aspects of translating them, then rethink the gods. Khorn is very quickly putting me off chaos.

        • CoffeeGrunt

          Probably, though it’d be interesting to see how that would translate. Slaanesh is definitely the hardest to do, IMO.

    • benn grimm

      Soon there will only be two gods; the god of red and axes and the god of green and gross; the concepts behind tzeentch and slaanesh being considered far too deep and controversial for the lil ‘uns…;)

      • Ben

        And boobs!! Don’t forget the whips, chains, and boobs!

      • Marky

        Telling kids it’s cool to Cut people up to offer blood to your god isn’t contraversial where your from?

        • spacemonk

          Offering blood to God? That’s the first lesson in Sunday School.

          • benn grimm

            Well, drinking the blood of christ, but still…;)

        • benn grimm

          No in my society many drink wine symbolising the blood of a long dead man believed by many to be the son of god. Sounds mental i know…;)

  • Azhrarn

    I guess all those rumours of Sigmar being a lost Primarch were true, because here we see the first images of the new Sigmarines. 😀

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  • hamilton geyser

    looks great.

    • David Dutton

      I know I’m in the minority, but I liked the feathers and frill. It’s meant to look like the landsnecht. Still, these are impressive models. I just hope I can still use them with my original empire army.

      • oliver izzard

        we’re all minorities, you’re not a small minority … plus if they destroy the empire they’re going to loose most german players …
        but the idea is to get new players, not to make the old ones happy, so are they advertising to a new potential market? cause I only see old players talking

  • Ajeje_Brazorf

    looks like sh*t

    • Parthis


      This is the kind of balanced, well considered opinion I can get behind.

      • Ajeje_Brazorf

        esthetically they do not look like warhammer models but a strange mix of sanguinary guard, the barbarian brothers and warmahordes
        like this way ?

        • Parthis

          Exactly… and that’s a bad thing because… ?

          If GW had just tweaked existing models and kicked out a Starter Box set you and your ilk would be here calling them lazy, uninspired, etc.

          Personally I think he new minis are a step in the right direction – if you’re going to reboot, then really reboot.

          • Ajeje_Brazorf

            it is a private company , totally free of making what they think to be the right product, but , anyone in gw know the words “customer satisfaction” or “market analysis” ?? these images come in facebook yesterday, noone liked them at the best

          • Parthis

            1) It’s not a private company.

            2) Market Analysis shows WFB was done. Market Analysis shows they *needed* to change things. Market Analysis shows you that companies that don’t, die.

            3) Customer satisfaction is more than just “Gee I hope Ajeje_Brazorf likes our new minis”

            You’ve yet to see the minis properly, see the ruleset, play the game or experience the scope.

            And so on.

          • Ajeje_Brazorf

            sad but marked doesn’t work like you said; people see minis,
            people do not like minis,
            people do not buy minis
            people go to play hordes or oldhammer or some like it

          • Seweryn Brudny

            and thats exactly what I`m going to do :/ if I`d like to play with those kind of minis there is plenty of systems that offer them. Warhammer was one and only… and the worst thing is that I`lll have to try sell this in my shop…

          • Mark Pearce

            I saw the minis, I like the minis, I’ll be buying the minis, don’t generalise.

          • Ajeje_Brazorf

            every coin has two faces, you like, you buy; other people (and actually are the majority of people i’ve heard of) will not buy, or at least will buy to make adeptus custodes conversions

          • CoffeeGrunt


            – Ajeje 2K15

          • Ajeje_Brazorf

            straw man
            keep calm and please don’t shout, and take your pills

          • CoffeeGrunt

            You don’t seem to understand what a strawman is.

          • Ajeje_Brazorf

            whoo we have a badass over here,
            i did’t said what you reported, so it is a straw man, study before posting

          • CoffeeGrunt

            Badass? You’re just here to start arguments.

            Carry on.

          • Agent OfBolas

            And this is something I’m doing since some time. Playing older versions of Warhammer as they were much better than things we got now or we will get with 9th edition…

            Why round bases? There are other games with round bases, and they have for sure much better rules.

            I was playing WFB for the feel of marching huge armies, now GW wants to make just another game… but with worse rules (I bet on this)

          • Badgerboy1977

            “noone liked them at the best”

            I saw several Facebook feeds yesterday with around 100 comments each talking about these models and i’d say roughly 90% of those were positive.
            That also goes for the comments on faeit as well and I’m sure there’s many others.

            It all depends on where you get your info from quite frankly, if I purely took the bols comment section as a guide for example I’d presume GW was so unpopular that no-one buys their products, which considering they’re by far and away the most successful games company of their type would seem unlikely.

          • Ajeje_Brazorf

            it is the most succesful games company with sales constantly dropping

          • Badgerboy1977

            1: we don’t know what’s actually affecting their profits and whether it’s just restructuring or market forces at play for example
            2: they are still way ahead of the competition and are still making large profits, just not as large as they have done in the past.

          • Ajeje_Brazorf

            1. we know : people do not buy their minis anymore
            2. they are rapidly decreasing their profits, very rapidly, and they are desperately trying to push sales up with new kits (imperial knigts) factions (astra militarium, cult mechanicus) and games (age of sigmar) released very quickly

          • Badgerboy1977

            Both of those are opinion not facts, unless you have some hard evidence to back it up of course?
            Which is unlikely as you’d need to be employed at GW hq to know either of those things for sure.
            Oh and those kits are not designed over night by the way, they have these things planned sometimes years in advance.

          • Ajeje_Brazorf


            here there is the financial report of 2014, you can easly find at page 35 how the cash flow is decreased, and if you read more in deep you will find that most of the financial index are dropping

          • Badgerboy1977

            That does not tell us that “people do not buy their minis anymore” it shows that there was a small dip in overall sales compared to the previous few years but they are still doing extremely well even compared to only 5 years ago and who’s to say the new armies and games systems won’t reverse that dip in the next few years.

          • Ajeje_Brazorf

            “small dip”

          • Badgerboy1977

            Clearly neither of us are business analysts but I really can’t see where you’re getting a drop in operating profits of 45%, nothing I see in that report supports anywhere near those figures at all.
            Also we were talking about a drop in sales and that was around 8% globally according to that statement, which in terms of the fluctuating fortunes of the company over the years isn’t a huge amount.

          • Ajeje_Brazorf

            first page of the report, you can see the drop in the operating profits

          • Badgerboy1977

            It dropped from 20.2m to 15.4m which is not anywhere close to 45% and much of that could be accounted for by investments in technologies, new product lines, infrastructure changes etc.

          • Nameless

            “people do not buy their minis anymore” is a generalisation and clearly false, someone must be buying else they would go out of business pretty fast.

            of course they are releasing new kits, what companies don’t release new products?

            astra militarium are just renamed imperial guard, certainly not a new faction.

          • CoffeeGrunt

            I can vouch locally that holy crap we can’t stock enough Ad Mech right now for people, plus new releases of stuff that isn’t Space Marines typically get sold out the Saturday they release.

          • Ajeje_Brazorf

            so, why releasing so many models, bundles, rules and so , so quckly?
            but on bols you read the financial report of gw?

          • Hedwerx

            I buy their minis. So 1 is wrong straight out of the gate.

          • Ajeje_Brazorf

            also i buy, their minis, space wolves, so whfb sales are dropping, deal with it, the reboot of fantasy is mainly due to very poor, and dropping, sales

          • Marky

            But, we do know what works for other large companies… And we know gw are not copying them.

          • Talys

            I like ’em. The box set will probably have a low price tag for the miniatures you get in the box, so what the heck? Will try the game; can’t judge it before it’s out… LOL.

          • Ben_S

            What I’ve seen is probably more divided than that. But what really matters, presumably, is the view of kids who aren’t posting on forums.

          • francis maybury

            im sorry you loved the empire models so much you have to post so many times on this thread. the chaos minis look amazing compare the marauder equivalents to any previous chaos marauder sculpts. Sigmar’s army no longer looks in decline, empire and britannia make really generic armies that look like you threw a few fantasy models into a generic set of old timey warriors. if they want people to actually consider which side of the box they would like to collect the warriors of the god king are a lot more appealing.

          • Ajeje_Brazorf

            simply they do not match with the last 30 years of warhammer

          • francis maybury

            so… when i was eleven I bought my first warhammer starter set with the mistaken belief i could find anyone who bought the box set and wanted to play empire in the shop. there were at least five other people who bought the set when i did in my local store…. all of them wanted the orcs. i still have my empire models but never bought more for the army.

          • francis maybury

            ps i really like periods placed inappropriately

          • Marky

            Like the iron age in the 41st millennium?

            That’s funny full stop.

          • Matt

            See, now that’s a decent reply I can get behind. They don’t match. I’m really skeptical about this game. But the minis are lovely, though clearly not WHFB

          • Marky

            that might have been lazy… But I’d be buying it.

          • Parthis

            And the inverse is true for many people, including myself.

    • Agent OfBolas

      Chaos looks lovely but this something in gold armors looks terrible and totally out of Warhammer feel

  • Adam Murray

    We’re not in Kansas anymore.

    • Dan

      We’re in Mantica Toto…

  • Vladium NZL

    I’m gonna base them on sqaures just to mess with GW

    • denzark

      I’m sure they’ll all be losing sleep at Head Office…

      • Vladium NZL

        Nope but at least they match the rest.

  • Parthis

    Re point 1 – square bases aren’t dead yet, but clearly aren’t featured in the starter set.

    As you mentioned, wait for the whole rules release before we draw conclusions, but there are plenty of rumours indicating that Round and Square have a place in the game.

  • hamilton geyser

    As with music and everything else, no one is amazed by your ability to “spot the influences” even on the rare occasions you are accurate. It doesn’t make you an art critic. Why do people obsess over this so much?

  • Adam Murray

    Can’t believe they missed out Terry Gilliam’s Brazil

  • ted1138

    I can see a lot of these sets being bought by 40k players for conversions/counts as models.

    • Ben

      Which is probably (part of) the point. People have already used chaos, dark elder/dark elf to make conversions.. Kind of hard to make the Empire sync into 40k. An updated aesthetic is a good thing for cross selling.

  • Spacefrisian

    Dunno what others think, but i like the models.

  • Agent OfBolas

    I’m just worried that new “good” minnis will dominate WFB as like SM dominated WH40k because GW likes to put their efforts in to 1 army sale as it’s easier to plan… but it get heavy impact on game balance…

    And it won’t be a good thing.

    • Ajeje_Brazorf

      Dunno, actually they are the only army with an exixting armybook, on GW website there are no more fantasy armybook on sale

  • Rhaen

    If this is the direction they are taking 9th and not just AoS, this all seems like its been a ruse from GW; they don’t want to reboot WHF, they don’t want to introduce more players to it – they want to kill it off so they don’t have to spend resources on it and while they’re at it salvage any possible players over to 40k…

    • Retconned Legion

      If that was the intent, they’d merely stop selling it. Wasting money on new molds for miniatures to put people off isn’t something a publicly traded company would do.

      • Rhaen

        You’re new to the internet aren’t you? Taking everything around here literary ain’t going to work out too well for too long…

  • crevab

    Warhammer: Now with more warhammers

    • Slaanesh_Devotee

      Haha, yeah. But the whole Warhammer name did come from Sigmar’s Ghal Maraz in the first place.

      So I suppose it’s quite fitting that his lot are the ones to add more war hammers.

  • vonevilstein

    Good lord, it’s Dark Vengeance quality in Fantasy form. I will be buying this and I will be playing this. Can’t wait.

  • CoffeeGrunt

    Part of me was really hoping they’d go with Triangular Bases or something completely insane. I was looking forward to Rob Baer’s inevitable Sky-Fall article on it implying it might happen to 40K, and the hilarious over-reaction in the comments that often follows.

    • Retconned Legion

      They should have gone retro, hexagonal bases all the way.

      • Marky

        Octagonal would have been cool

    • Hedwerx

      All of the new miniatures will be mounted on n-dimensional cubes.

      • CoffeeGrunt

        I’m not sure if I upvoted for your comment or your avatar. Probably both. 😛

    • E65

      “Part of me was really hoping they’d go with Triangular Bases………”

      I was hoping for rhomboidal myself.

  • apackistany

    I’m excited and I don’t care what other people think! Said no one ever on this website ;).

    • francis maybury

      i like you haha.

      • apackistany

        Haha thanks I try.

  • spacemonk

    Notice the Chaos Lord with Flesh-hound? That’s two bases in one.
    The Flesh hound looks to be on a detachable piece of the base. You can see a slot in the edge and a line between the two models, yet all in one oval.

    • Retconned Legion

      That’s not a slot in the edge, it’s the knife of the Khorne fella in front.

      • spacemonk

        Except it follows across the top of the base too.

        • Retconned Legion

          Erm, no it doesn’t? I can’t see any dividing line at all, and what you called a notch is definitely the Khorne guys knife, it has a hand attached to it.

          • spacemonk

            Well, that’s what happens when I look at it on my phone instead of my PC.

  • vlad78

    I don’t like them. Period.

    Hope you’ll all enjoy the game.

    • Marky

      Maybe at another time of the month you will see things differently?

      • Awesome sexism

      • me

        A period joke?! Seriously?…

  • benn grimm

    First impressions; they found a way to put space marines into fantasy, and solve that age old conundrum of the 40k imperial player moving over to fantasy; if you wanted power armour saves you have to go to the dark side and play chaos. Now they’ve found a way to fix it and by the looks of it, reduce the armour of chaos warriors at the same time. Its sort of a genius move tbh. And some of them can fly. I mean, what’s not to like? 😉

  • Andy Barton

    So this is going to be the boxed set then. You can make out on the text under the pics. Looks like a good starting point. The minis look good, but that’s all we know so far I guess.z

  • Tesq

    mm if some rumors are true, sigmar warrior would have his onw faction and so breotonia and emp would continue to live after the recreation. And i hope so , cos i love chavalry, i hate square base, i want start fantasy before but i hate these fantasy space marine atm.

  • Andrew

    Pics are too blurry to say for sure, but these ain’t really fantasy looking to me. My first thought was “Not fantasy, lame, etc”. Then I realized that these might be a good basis for Inquisimunda models or something like that. Can’t say a word about game mechanics.

  • Ben

    Look nice. I haven’t bought models in over a decade due to life, etc. I’m interested to see what they do with Undead, and if the zombies, skeletons, and vampires get updated.

  • Alex Harvey

    Hmm. Looking closely, the models don’t seem to be all that close to Sanguinary Guard. Similar, but up close the open faces & style of of detail makes it quite different. Does look almost identical with the out of focus photo ;P
    Also worth noting, at first glance the wings seemed part of the characters, but again on closer look they seem to be on harnasses – similar to the Birdmen of Catrazza.

  • Jake Nolan

    I dunno, I love the Empire? models but they don’t belong here anymore. Chaos still looks like Chaos.

  • Katharon

    Say hello to my new 40K Custodes project.

  • karloss01

    Not sure on the Sons of Sigmar, would need better pictures to get a better idea. As for chaos; disappointed they yet again chose Khorne and would have much preferred if they just went undivided.

  • Alexander Golmen Berg

    The chaos side seems to get two units of marauders, a character with a fleshhound, a BSB, a chaos spawn and a small unit of warriors. Just need som square bases now

  • Stan

    I guess with the new proxy rules you can always play King of War with your old army and just say hell with it.

    Or even better one could just play Oldhammer.

  • OrksIsMadeFerRockin

    Why do i feel like the four page free rule book will just have one page of stats a bolded sentence saying in order to play this game refer to the warhammer 40k 7th edition rule book and three pages of copyright info. Good by fantasy despite what the Internet has been blaring for the past month me and my friends liked you. I’ll miss your blocks of troops, armies the size of well…armies, and the feeling of being the general of a medival high fantasy army.

    • OrksIsMadeFerRockin

      Before the Internet hate machine starts rolling my statement is merely me expressing my displeasure at the new aesthetic. Why was empire appealing to empire players? for me at least because they were just regular men surrounded on all sides by hulking monsters and unspeakable horrors. Why was WOC appealing? For me at least because they were the only 6 and a half foot tall heavily armored badass Viking death Knights. In my mind they have diminished both factions with this release that being said the models look good.

      • Bobsyouruncle

        I get what your saying , the whole super human thing just does not do it for me I’ve always liked the idea of the little guys taking on the odds be it a dwarf clansman grumbling into his beard or a crazy gobbo strapping a spike to their head and launching themselves skyward .

    • Michael Bradbury

      Its incredible how everyone’s WFB rulebooks have disappeared into thin air meaning they can never play the game again.

    • mac40k

      No stats, you’ll need the associated war scrolls for that.

  • MightyOrang

    The sculpts are pretty sweet — but so very much not what I expect from the Warhammet aesthetic. They look like great material for conversions. But the grimdark of the Old World is definitely lacking.

    But maybe that’s the point.

    What I do see here is a sign that GW doesn’t know what to do re its fantasy game — so they’re jumping into a super saturated market to compete with smaller games rather than refining their core product back into something people are excited to play.

    Ultimately it all comes back to the price of these models — a smaller game’s appeal is blunted when prices just go up and up and up.

    • Retconned Legion

      That’s why i dubious over AoS being the big turnaround they want. As far as i can see, they are doing nothing to address the actual problems that caused the decline in sales – namely price and complete lack of advertising outside of their own stores – in favour of a quick fix: Hey Space Marines sell, let’s make fantasy Space Marines.

  • xxvaderxx

    Are this to be the new regular empire or the superhuman faction?

  • Robomummy

    Please note the insane level of detail on this incredibly blurry picture.

  • labrochette

    for me the most important thing is that there will be no cost for the unit ,you play what you want!?

  • msgellar

    In the future we have space marines; lots of them. In the Age of Sigmar, we have space marines.

    I do like the look of the chaos models.

  • Chumbalaya

    The angel winged dudes look pretty cool, but the rest is typical overwrought, greebled out GW schlock. Give me fur and plate armored chaos warriors over roided out half naked axe dancers any day.

    • Red_Five_Standing_By

      Roids for the Roid God!!

  • PsychosisPC

    I’m supposed to be excited, all the fan-boys tell me that, but I’m not excited at all….

  • Krizzab

    Sigmar’s alive!

  • Nobody

    Really? Every single edition, after I spend a lot of money on an army, new rules and new crap comes out and makes my list useless, and I have to restart and spend more money just to keep playing. That’s not fair. That’s not what a game supposed to be. I’m out of this hobby.

    • Red_Five_Standing_By

      This is why you create collections of models and not a buy a list of models. Lists come and lists go. Models are forever.

      Unless GW reboots the game.

  • I’ve not played or collected Fantasy for years so have been intrigued by what GW are gunna do with it. If these had been released as Fantasy minis (pre 9th ed) I wouldn’t like them because the aesthetic doesn’t fit to my mind. But, with the new setting I feel more open to the possibility of liking them. I’ll just have to wait for some better pics, and possibly better paint jobs, before making up my mind.

  • Captain Raptor

    Well they finally put Space Marines in fantasy. I suppose I shouldn’t be surprised, the only thing GW can do well is make Space Marines. I miss the old Empire units already, all they needed to take on Chaos was a halberd and a big silly hat.

    • georgelabour

      Actually they’ve been there ever since they released the realms of Chaos books way way back in the pre-history of first person shooters.

      AKA the 90s.

    • COsteve

      Really? Space marines are my least favorite faction model-wise. That said, I do think these knights/angels? of Sigmar are pretty cool looking. Maybe its their Balthazar Gelt style heads.

      • ieyke

        “Space Marines are my least favorite, but these Space Marines are pretty cool”

  • silashand

    And the GW apologists strike again. It’s amazing how hard they will bash other companies for stealing ideas from GW, but then if GW does the same thing then it’s obviously been around for years and “not the same thing.” lol

    For the minis, meh. They look like 40K to me.

    • Jordan Ehdieb

      Oh yes, fanboys to the max. Their heads are up their own backsides. GW is dead to me now. At least Total War Warhammer is coming out next year.

  • Mike mad cow

    While range looks Derptastic …

  • andrewforrest

    Looking at the models – they are not to my taste, however, they are of a very very high standard to good on GW for pushing ahead there. The Chaos have never been my favoured style but general reactions are quite good. the Sigmarites do have a heavy bias towards 40k style (or perhaps we are being unfair – sculptors have their own styles so it could be that more “40k” type of people worked on it, or they were instructed to go that way). Either way – it’s a strong shift by GW for this “new” range. Will it get more people interested? different people? The same people? … Probably a mix and it will take a while to see the trickle down.

    As for the “End of the World” and this being the “New and Craptacular Skirmish only Fantasy Game” – I have to disagree.

    There was a translated Spanish rumour a while ago mentioning the Age of Sigmar “exact description” being just a part of a much larger plan by GW to reboot Warhammer (Fantasy as we know it but you won’t hear that name anymore)

    It described 3 “Styles” of Warhammer: Age of Sigmar (described as a Warhammer Skirmish Game – EXACTLY what it looks/smells like), Age of Steel (Warhammer as we know it) and the End Times (mental all out Characterhammer and mental magic)

    I think AoS is the first stage in a whole reboot – not a total destroying of everything that has happened in the past (GW has invested too much in product to totally scrap it) encompassing the old where it can but allowing for huge and new narratives, models, ideas and a whole new dynamic on the way the Warhammer “universe” works

    Other bits/bits of the puzzle:

    • On the Chaos leaked pic it mentions “The Warhammer Age of Sigmar tells the first Chapter of this battle against Chaos …” first chapter? first in a set of interlinking yet in their own right – separate games?. If you have a core set of mechanic rules that are robust enough you can build on it and make a bigger and bigger game (even heading up to Apocolype size games)

    • The AoS logo is branded with Sigmar/Chaos … Strange for it being the “Core” Warhammer (Fantasy) game don’t you think? We have already heard that the other races survived and will be around for the next games – so why brand this game specifically for them? … This also fits with the “multiple game/reboot” idea

    • The Studio/Warhammer Warhammer world Lizardman army pictures that was doing the rounds a short while ago – only SOME of the models were on round bases – ones that I think would be “effective” in a low-model-count/high point/power skirmish game (Temple Guard and Saurus Cav are the ones I remember) … Why not ALL? Could it be that GW will use AoS as a smaller steppingstone game for Warhammer (Fantasy), you know – like they have been missing for years? I think so.

    So there we go – these models and this “Game” are not “9th Ed” they are the reboot precursor – the entry game with a low model count and simple (exciting?) rules that will allow new players, 40k diehards and all of the past-missed income stream potentials to try and get into the “Bigger” game.

    That’s my take on it all 🙂

  • Izzy reggie

    Is that Sigmarite guy riding a not-undead version of the Mortarch mounts?

  • kaptinscuzgob

    i really like them, theyre pretty impressive for snap fit models.

  • Drew

    I’m interested to see where this goes, as a die-hard WFB fan. And as for all the comments about mantic, don’t get me wrong, deadzone and dreadball are fun and will exist as replacements for the (much better but no longer supported) Necromunda and Blood Bowl games, but there is no way on God’s green earth Kings of War or Warpath are ever going to seriously threaten GW. Warmachine/Hordes have a better chance, and even they aren’t going to dethrone GW (X-Wing is also a big contender, but not really in direct game-type competition). The best we can hope for is that eventually all this competition (such as it is) will make GW think twice about the way they do business.

  • Thomas Gardiner

    For any fans of Mitchell and Webb =P

    • euansmith

      Are they going to do a BMX Bandit figure too?

      • Thomas Gardiner

        I think his BMX abilities would seem a bit redundant, don’t you? 😉

      • Red_Five_Standing_By

        Pre-9th, Brettonians were the BMX Bandits of Warhammer Fantasy!

  • Neil Carleton

    Anyone else wondering if the Sanguinor is just a Sigmarite hero thrown into the 40k universe by some Chaos shenanigans?

  • If this is what Fantasy 9th is going to be, then I’m actually going to have to start collecting that now too.

  • Luc Voyer

    got that feeling of those are the left overs of some 40k blood angel army, no buy from me for sure.

    • standardleft

      what about the chaos dudies?

      I think they’re ace.